Author Topic: Random Old School Observations  (Read 73630 times)

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Offline Big Green

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Random Old School Observations
« on: November 23, 2009, 02:23:06 AM »
I figured that since we have a question thread, I'd make a thread that can function as a CTDWT for Old School stuff.

I was doing research for a project I'm working on and ran across an article from the New York Times from 1915 in which it states that the Manhattan Athletic Club was denied a license by the New York State Athletic Commission because of the actions of the McMahon brothers, who owed back taxes, rent on the buildings they used and even money to the boxers themselves.

The McMahons denied association with Manhattan A.C. (and obviously Manhattan A.C. denied association with them). At the time, the McMahons ran the Empire A.C. and said that if they violated the rules then the state could take their license.

In a statement, the State Athletic Commission said that it would be injurious to the sport of boxing to grant a license to any company associated with the McMahon family.

Who were the McMahon brothers? Roderick and Edward McMahon, the grandfather and great-uncle of Vince McMahon.

Offline FroGG_NeaLL

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« Reply #1 on: November 24, 2009, 05:49:16 PM »
So that's how they got started in the wrasslin business, huh? Interesting shit, I never knew that the McMahons were dirty boxing promoters. This explains alot.

Offline CuckBright7831

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« Reply #2 on: November 24, 2009, 06:37:23 PM »
As I pointed out in the Survivor Series chat the other night - Mr. Perfect only won 6 PPV matches in his entire WWF career.

I originally said 5 but someone pointed out that he won at Survivor Series 88



HEY, TRTSM:

Quote from: Cowboy Numbers
same with cwm
he's a stay at home dad with no education
what's he gonna teach his kids? how to be a loser?

Offline alkeiper

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« Reply #3 on: November 24, 2009, 09:22:38 PM »
So that's how they got started in the wrasslin business, huh? Interesting shit, I never knew that the McMahons were dirty boxing promoters. This explains alot.
I wouldn't say they were dirty.  Athletic promotions were pretty corrupt in their own right at times and it was difficult for promoters to navigate the minefield.  The elder McMahons were also involved in other ventures like negro league baseball.

Offline "Dot Com" Matt Postin (heel)

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« Reply #4 on: December 10, 2009, 03:58:45 PM »
Nothing gets on my nerves more than an old WCW/Flair title defense where Gary Capetta is announcing the dwindling time limit minute by minute and the babyface only goes for sleepers and submissions and knocks Flair out of the ring in between. And yes, I'm watching Flair/Scott Steiner from the Clash.

Offline Brodypedia

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« Reply #5 on: December 21, 2009, 04:14:52 AM »
WCW was doomed from the very start:

NWA World Championship Wrestling April 6, 1985
**This was the very first NWA World Championship Wrestling show promoted by Jim Crockett**

Final match with Mid-Atlantic Champion Buzz Tyler cancelled after ring rope problem

Offline Harley Quinn

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« Reply #6 on: December 21, 2009, 08:03:10 AM »
Been watching old clips of Sting from his initial Crow run of November 1996 through December 1996 and several things popped up...

1:  The WCW crowds really weren't that vocal about chanting.  They'd cheer or boo, certainly and quite loudly for Sting but there was even a second rate feel to them.  They'd constantly throw balled up paper in the ring, regardless of who was in it, and even the "Hogan" chant in September was fairly small and lack luster.  It was notable that it was only a handful of fans providing the chant.  Just watch that chant and compare it to WWF fans chanting a name or insults (i.e. Shawn is Gay) from that time period.

2:  The ring ramp on Nitro was so insanely long and the camera work was really poor at times.   If you watch 1997/1998 clips of Raw and Nitro, you'll see that WWF cameramen were usually positioned in certain areas (i.e. to the right of the wrestler at the base of the entrance ramp to catch them going up the stairs or way down the ramp to catch them as they're coming down the ramp) whereas Nitro cameramen literally seemed to be doing everything in the spur of the moment.  There's a bit where DDP, coming out with a shoulder injury, has a cameraman literally almost zoomed into his face walking backwards with DDP to the point that DDP snarls for the guy to get out of his way.  It'd be a better shot if the cameraman was just 4-5 steps further back.

In the above mentioned September run, there's a bit where Sting grabs a sign that says "Hulk vs. Sting" on it to prove his point and show to J.J. Dillon he wants Hogan.  Well the genius cameraman zooms in on Sting's face for 3-4 seconds and then pans down to the sign for a couple seconds before Sting drops it and walks away.

There was another shot where Sting had come down from the rafters halfway down the ramp in between the nWo and DDP in the ring.  The "focus" was mainly on Sting's back complete with pointing his bat at the nWo and their reactions.  Sting tosses his bat over his shoulder and the entire arc of the bat is entirely missed as the camera just managed to capture DDP's catching of it.  We then cut back to Sting's back.  It's such a shitty shooting of a good angle because we don't get a look at Sting's front for a fair while, we don't get ANY reaction shot from DDP to Sting's arrival, and there's constant cutting from the ring to the nWo when Sting/DDP are standing in the ring.

3:  The announcers being stationed so far away from the ring was horrible as they looked like they couldn't really see the action compared to the guys at Raw (and note the later movement of Raw announcers by the entrance that IMO hurt things).  The whole element of the announcers being on top of the action was lost.  Even in the late 1996 shows, WCW had Schiavone and Zybysko set up at a crappy looking announce table at ring side.  For such a rich company, they really managed to make several parts of Nitro come off as second rate.

When wrestlers talk about the difference between WCW and WWF/E and compare it to an entertainment program producing a wrestling show vs. a wrestling company producing a wrestling show, it's really obvious to see looking back.

Offline strummer

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« Reply #7 on: December 21, 2009, 09:15:03 AM »
Watching the "Macho King" Coronation and the WWF had quite the heel roster at the time

Savage, Perfect, Tully and Arn, Barry Windham and Rude (not in the ring at the time but still on the roster)

if they even gave a damn about workrate at the time they could have put on some fantastic shows (for smarks)

Offline Brodypedia

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« Reply #8 on: December 22, 2009, 06:51:26 PM »
Nov 92 Retro Observer posted today had this tidbit:

HBO is toying with the idea of doing a dramatic TV series with a wrestling backdrop.

-----

And:

Want to know how Kimala got his name? Back about ten years ago, Jim Harris came into the Memphis territory and Jerry Lawler had an idea to make him an African savage. They saw the name of a Dr. Kimala in a National Geographic who was researching in Uganda, did a video of him stalking around Jerry Jarrett's backyard, and the rest is history.

------

and:

A record called "Slam" sung by several WWF wrestlers will be released in England on 11/30 and is considered to have a good shot at being the Christmas No. 1 pop song in the country.

This needs to be found ASAP

Offline FroGG_NeaLL

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« Reply #9 on: December 22, 2009, 07:39:14 PM »
Here ya go, Brody.


Offline strummer

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« Reply #10 on: December 22, 2009, 07:54:09 PM »
the record was produced by Simon Cowell

he took heat for it but said it would make money due to the gate at Summerslam 92

Offline Brodypedia

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« Reply #11 on: December 23, 2009, 03:55:12 AM »
Here ya go, Brody.



I thought of that song right away, but couldn't fathom "no.1 pop song" from it.

Offline Big Green

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« Reply #12 on: December 23, 2009, 04:30:46 AM »
Here's a random observation:

WWE has had its lowest lows when it markets exclusively to children and its two biggest boom periods were the results of marketing to teenagers. Despite the tameness of Rock and Wrestling, they were still marketing to teens through the use of MTV and celebrities like Cyndi Lauper.

You'd think WWE would learn from this.

EDIT - Before anyone points out the cartoonish of the late 80s, I'd like to remind them that 1984-1987 was relatively serious and straight forward in its approach to characters and that was the period during which the boom period was at its hottest.

The Saturday Morning cartoon on CBS was a great idea for capturing the kiddie demographic though. It didn't affect the on-screen product but it got the WWF characters over to kids while not alienating the teenage audience.

Offline FroGG_NeaLL

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« Reply #13 on: December 25, 2009, 05:18:24 AM »
Slam Jam was no. 4 on the UK charts in 92. True story.

Offline Juggalo Cop

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« Reply #14 on: December 25, 2009, 05:28:16 AM »
Yeah, the Wrestlemania album was big deal over there.  Simon Cowell read an article about the Summerslam '92 selling out Wembley and decided that a record with wrestlers would be a hit.  I suppose it's no more shameful than unleashing Clay Aiken onto the public.

Offline Kahran Ramsus

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« Reply #15 on: December 25, 2009, 11:43:15 AM »
Quote
EDIT - Before anyone points out the cartoonish of the late 80s, I'd like to remind them that 1984-1987 was relatively serious and straight forward in its approach to characters and that was the period during which the boom period was at its hottest.

It didn't really get silly until about 1993.   

Offline WKU Tops

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« Reply #16 on: December 28, 2009, 11:59:34 AM »
I was making my way through my 1993 RAW season and watched one of the strangest matches ever where Kamala (recently turned face) squashed the Brookyln Brawler.  The crowd was actually getting excited over Kamala and he had some fans beating their stomach's like he was and after hitting a splash he wasn't sure how to pin him so Slick had to get them to yell at Kamala to turn him over correctly for the pinfall.  I was just taken aback because I've never seen a Kamala match where the crowd had gotten behind him so much.

Offline Brodypedia

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« Reply #17 on: December 28, 2009, 04:52:10 PM »
Quote
EDIT - Before anyone points out the cartoonish of the late 80s, I'd like to remind them that 1984-1987 was relatively serious and straight forward in its approach to characters and that was the period during which the boom period was at its hottest.

It didn't really get silly until about 1993.   

1990 had Rockabilly Greg Valentine, TUGBOAT, Red Rooster still crowing around, GOBBELY GOOKER, The Blow Away Diet Skit, and some might argue THE MOUNTIE

1991 had...Berzerker, Repo Man, Big Bully Busick the 1920's Strongman Bully, SKINNER, Ricky Steamboat being "THE DRAGON", Tito Santana becomes a Madator, Saba Simba, and IRS

Offline Brodypedia

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« Reply #18 on: December 30, 2009, 04:36:05 PM »
Ed Leslie (as "Ed Leslie") once wrestled on world wide and the announcers spent the entire match making fun of all his gimmicks and laughing at him....

I would love a Youtube video of this...

Offline Brodypedia

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« Reply #19 on: January 01, 2010, 04:48:26 AM »


Lawler breaks Kayfabe and calls Brakus "Ackim" at the end

Offline Brodypedia

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« Reply #20 on: January 01, 2010, 05:32:41 AM »
"On the SMW year-end television show that aired this weekend, in the credits at the end of the show they listed Physician in attendance at ringside at SMW matches as Dr. Kevorkian, and listed the person in charge at the SMW Day Care Center as Michael Jackson." - (WON 1994-01-10)

Offline Baby Shoes

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« Reply #21 on: January 01, 2010, 06:15:58 AM »
"On the SMW year-end television show that aired this weekend, in the credits at the end of the show they listed Physician in attendance at ringside at SMW matches as Dr. Kevorkian, and listed the person in charge at the SMW Day Care Center as Michael Jackson." - (WON 1994-01-10)

If only they listed Jeffrey Dahmer for catering.
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Offline Brodypedia

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« Reply #22 on: January 01, 2010, 06:25:40 AM »


I never realized this is how the Savage/Snake feud started...

Offline Monsoon Classic

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« Reply #23 on: January 01, 2010, 10:15:08 AM »
I read this was how the feud started but I never knew it came before the official Snake heel turn.
Check out my YouTube page for over 2,000 classic WWF & WCW videos:
https://www.youtube.com/user/MrMonsoonClassic/videos

Offline mellow

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« Reply #24 on: January 03, 2010, 02:28:20 PM »
Something I was discussing with a friend of mine on New Year's: what's the deal with all four Tiger Masks having alliterated names?

Satoru Sayama
Mitsuharu Misawa
Koji Kanemoto
Yoshihiro Yamazaki

Offline Brodypedia

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« Reply #25 on: January 03, 2010, 05:06:57 PM »
If you ever wondered what it would be like to have Comedian Gallagher whip your ass, you should watch some Roland Boch matches

Antonio Inoki vs Roland Bock

Offline Brodypedia

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« Reply #26 on: January 06, 2010, 05:42:22 AM »
Sam Houston needed to take lessons from his brother on how to throw a worked punch.

NWA's old clip job style of releasing PPV cards are really annoying.  Turning the whole undercard into 3 min highlight reels is quite under welming


Offline Brodypedia

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« Reply #27 on: January 06, 2010, 06:03:20 AM »
Starcade 85...I like how a DEATH MATCH ends by one man climbing a pole to grab a sombreo.

Ref is in a head to toe Banana Yellow outfit. Awesome.

Ron Bass getting MASSIVE pops for no - selling asphyxiation is tremendous... RON BASS is more over than 85% of the current WWE roster....

It saddens me to think Arn Anderson would probably be flannel wearing hick with Jesse Gordy or something if he came up today...that is if they let him out of developmental

Offline Brodypedia

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« Reply #28 on: January 06, 2010, 06:45:01 AM »
Starcade 85, Just to show the NWA could match Mid 80's WWF goofiness we get a Man dressed as a woman teaming with a hippie, wrestling in a Street fight and managed by a prostitute.  


Offline Brodypedia

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« Reply #29 on: January 06, 2010, 11:15:29 AM »
Starcade 86 may have set the record for most people bleeding on a non "hardcore" promotion card

Dusty,Tully Blancard, Ron Garvin, Jimmy Valient, Rick Rude, Wahoo McDaniels, JJ Dillion, Bobby Eaton Ric Flair, among others all juiced.

Offline Brodypedia

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« Reply #30 on: January 06, 2010, 11:35:07 AM »
How long was Rick Stewart around the NWA? He's announcing for Starcade 86. And who was this guy???

Also in one of those great little moments we have a thread dedicated too, during the main event pull apart brawl with Flair and Nikita, Brad Armstrong and a host of other mid carders are trying to seperate the 2 men.  Jimmy Garvin comes in and instead of joining the herd trying to split the 2 men up, Garvin takes a few shots at Armstrong since they had wrestled earlier in the night....then he joins the pack in trying to calm Flair and Nikita down.



Offline Baby Shoes

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« Reply #31 on: January 06, 2010, 11:44:49 AM »
Starcade 86 may have set the record for most people bleeding on a non "hardcore" promotion card

Dusty,Tully Blancard, Ron Garvin, Jimmy Valient, Rick Rude, Wahoo McDaniels, JJ Dillion, Bobby Eaton Ric Flair, among others all juiced.

I have this show on VHS.  I'm going to have to go back and watch it as I never realized this many guys juiced on the same card.  If I recall correctly, this show had a couple announce teams, but I'd love it with all the juicing they cut to one of the announce teams only to have one of the commentators in a Flair-like Crimson Mask.
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Offline alkeiper

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« Reply #32 on: January 06, 2010, 09:38:52 PM »
J.J. Dillon was as contrived as a bladejob gets.

Offline Rendclaw

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« Reply #33 on: January 06, 2010, 11:12:13 PM »
It wasn't much better at GAB 87 Wargames, either. His selling was so horrible, the Road Warriors looked at him like "What the fuck, JJ?"
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Offline Brodypedia

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« Reply #34 on: January 09, 2010, 05:41:19 AM »


Here's a rare one: Abby the Butcher BabyFace "promo"

Offline The Real DXP

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« Reply #35 on: January 09, 2010, 05:46:59 AM »
It wasn't much better at GAB 87 Wargames, either. His selling was so horrible, the Road Warriors looked at him like "What the fuck, JJ?"

JJ sold his broken shoulder pretty well. I it looked like death.

Offline God King Emperor Kamala

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« Reply #36 on: January 10, 2010, 03:36:23 PM »


This video is one of my favorites of all time. I think I posted this in The YouTube thread but it got lost in the shuffle.

I lose it everytime the Hulkmobile crashes through the gates of Heaven.

Offline FroGG_NeaLL

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« Reply #37 on: January 11, 2010, 01:36:48 PM »
I just watched part one of WCW's Spring Stampede 98 on WWE on demand, and they've edited Booker's "Hulk Hogan, we comin for YOU, nigga!" to be "Hulk Hogan, we comin for YOU, sucka!"

Offline timmy8271

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« Reply #38 on: January 11, 2010, 07:19:10 PM »
How long was Rick Stewart around the NWA? He's announcing for Starcade 86. And who was this guy???

Also in one of those great little moments we have a thread dedicated too, during the main event pull apart brawl with Flair and Nikita, Brad Armstrong and a host of other mid carders are trying to seperate the 2 men.  Jimmy Garvin comes in and instead of joining the herd trying to split the 2 men up, Garvin takes a few shots at Armstrong since they had wrestled earlier in the night....then he joins the pack in trying to calm Flair and Nikita down.




If it's the same Rick Stewart i'm thinking of(Blonde hair with glasses?) he used to be an announcer for Southeastern Wrestling in Alabama.

Offline Brodypedia

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« Reply #39 on: January 13, 2010, 05:26:05 AM »
WWE has Bockwinkel vs Flair from 1986 Winnipeg for sure from an AWA show, but I just found out Hennig also fought Flair around this point and I can only hope its on tape!

Offline tekcop

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« Reply #40 on: January 13, 2010, 05:32:32 AM »

Offline Baby Shoes

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« Reply #41 on: January 13, 2010, 06:54:58 AM »
I found myself reading Bryan Adams' profile on Wikipedia and found this interesting tidbit on Kona Crush:

Quote
In 1996, Adams had an uncredited role in the Bollywood movie Khiladiyon Ka Khiladi. In the movie, he played "Crush" and was killed by "The Undertaker" (played by Brian Lee) in a wrestling match.
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Kevin Nash: Kidman wears a wife beater

Offline Brodypedia

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« Reply #42 on: January 13, 2010, 07:06:12 AM »

Offline Brodypedia

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« Reply #43 on: January 13, 2010, 07:34:30 AM »


Mulligan (who wrestled as a face at Slamboree 93) makes a vaguely heel-ish remark about Dusty and Dustin here...  and I suppose you could argue makes a Aryan reference as well

Offline no fact, no matter

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« Reply #44 on: January 13, 2010, 08:32:45 AM »
Something I was discussing with a friend of mine on New Year's: what's the deal with all four Tiger Masks having alliterated names?

Satoru Sayama
Mitsuharu Misawa
Koji Kanemoto
Yoshihiro Yamazaki

Hah, that's awesome. I never noticed that before.
You should probably put your bandit hat on now.

Offline Brodypedia

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« Reply #45 on: January 21, 2010, 04:42:15 AM »
Prince Iaukea: Pro Wrestling Illustrated ranked him #97 of the 500 best singles wrestlers during the "PWI Years" in 2003


!WAT!

Offline Brodypedia

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« Reply #46 on: January 21, 2010, 09:10:54 AM »


Old NWA fans will LOVE this series

Offline alkeiper

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« Reply #47 on: January 26, 2010, 08:15:36 AM »
Saw a book on the Philadelphia Spectrum while browsing at Barnes n' Noble.  They had a list of the wrestlers who had the most matches in the building.

1. Bob Backlund
2. Tony Garea
3. Hulk Hogan
4. Tito Santana
5. Mr. Fuji
6. Johnny Rodz
7. Baron Mikel Scicluna
8. Bruno Sammartino
9. Bret Hart
10. Randy Savage




Also picked up a copy of Chris Jericho's book for $5.95.

Offline Brodypedia

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« Reply #48 on: January 26, 2010, 03:41:31 PM »
Quote
You know all the stories you hear about Bobby being drunk all the time in WCW? You will never hear Bobby any drunker on TV than the July 19th, 1999 Nitro. You can barely understand half of what he says because it's so slurred. He isn't rambling, but he's drunk as fuck and it's really, really obvious. If anyone has seen the clip from the Tonight Show where Ed was clearly super drunk and Johnny could tell right away, it reminds me very much of that. Bobby is trying really hard to not let on he's shitfaced.

MUST FIND FOOTAGE

Offline God King Emperor Kamala

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« Reply #49 on: January 26, 2010, 03:51:23 PM »
I'll get Smues on it.

IIRC, I've mentioned this show as a candidate before. It also has Buff Bagwell in blackface, an appearance by Arliss, a rematch of the WrestleMania VIII main event, and a rare appearance by Eric Bischoff: Wise cracking, cool babyface.