Author Topic: Old School Observations/Questions: 2018-2019 Edition  (Read 31205 times)

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Offline Brodypedia

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #100 on: March 11, 2017, 07:06:25 PM »
http://culturecrossfire.com/wrestling/eddiegilbertvol3/

The final installment of the "Best of Eddie Gilbert" collection sees Gilbert in the Mid-South, building a stable with Missy Hyatt while her charge John Tatum finds himself left in the cold. We see Gilbert and company competing with Terry Taylor, The Fantastics, and The Missing Link. We next take a look at Gilbert's attempts to give a portrait of himself to a lucky fan, leading to a goofy blow off. Then comes Gilbert's alliance with Communists, leading to an epic angle with Bill Watts and the Russian flag. Dr. Death, Ted Dibiase and others all play a role. We close with the Freebirds picking a fight with "Cowboy" Bill Watts. I've added as many videos as possible so you can enjoy the journey along the way.

Offline Fan of Sports with Integrity

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #101 on: March 12, 2017, 11:46:31 PM »



this is so good. This angle should have been legendary. Twenty years ahead of the times. the booing at the end lirl

Offline Richard

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #102 on: March 13, 2017, 06:51:28 PM »
According to wrestlingdata, Hogan actually wrestled several house show matches between Wrestlemania 9 and KotR. He teamed with Beefcake against Money Inc and won by dq in each of them. Guess it's the WWF's fault he never defended the belt during that time.

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #103 on: March 24, 2017, 05:30:32 PM »
http://culturecrossfire.com/wrestling/wrasslin-back-day-wwf-meadowlands-12101984/

The Meadowlands plays host to Hulk Hogan defending his WWF title against Big John Studd. Plus Jimmy Snuka butts heads with Bob Orton Jr, and JYD clashes with Mr. Wonderful. Roddy Piper is on hand to provide a race baiting promo. Bobby Heenan wrestles in possibly one of the worst matches of his career. Ken Patera, Johnny Valiant, George Wells and Buddy Rose face off with jabronis and a women's tag match sets the bar for boring...

Offline THE TUGSTER

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #104 on: April 01, 2017, 02:35:38 PM »
Had this in mind to post but forgot about it yesterday, which marked 20 years since this aired

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Offline CookieMueller

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #105 on: April 06, 2017, 08:50:00 AM »
When did they start doing all the hoopla around Wrestlemania? Were there events around NYC during WMX weekend? Obviously nothing like what they do now, but when did it go from "huge night in wrestling" to "huge weekend in wrestling" to now where it's basically a whole week?

Offline THE TUGSTER

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #106 on: April 06, 2017, 09:21:33 AM »
They started doing the fan access event (or at least really pushing it as a thing) sometime during the Attitude Era IIRC, then the HOF was rebooted and added to Mania time in 2004.

This is from the WrestleMania Axxess wikipedia page

Quote
The first event happened in 1988, when the World Wrestling Federation in association with The Trump Organization prepared a small festival to celebrate WrestleMania IV. It included autograph signings, a brunch, and a five kilometer run; the event was held again in 1989 for WrestleMania V. In 1992, a festival was held the day of WrestleMania VIII which included a WWF superstar look-alike contest and a tournament for the WWF WrestleFest arcade game. In 1993, the WWF held a "WrestleMania Brunch" the day of WrestleMania IX at Caesars Palace, during the course of which Lex Luger attacked Bret Hart. In 1994, the WWF offered "Fan Fest" for the weekend of WrestleMania X, which allowed fans to step inside a WWF ring, participate in games, meet superstars, and purchase merchandise; the event was followed up in 1995 with another "Fan Fest" for WrestleMania XI. In 1999, the WWF held its first Saturday pre-WrestleMania event taking place on March 27, 1999. WrestleMania Rage Party as it was known was televised live on the USA Network from 10:00 p.m. to 11:00 p.m. (EST). The event was to be held at the Pennsylvania Convention Center. The idea of the event was "...to celebrate the final WrestleMania of the millennium..."

The following year the WWF held its first WrestleMania Axxess event at the Anaheim Convention Center expanding upon the party idea of WrestleMania Rage Party. The event included autograph signings and mementos to inductees of the WWE Hall of Fame. There were also activities where fans could enter a wrestling ring and commentate a wrestling match.  In 2001, WrestleMania Axxess was held at the Reliant Hall which expanded upon the event by adding numerous activities including areas where attendees could buy special merchandise, see a production truck and check out special WWE vehicles.  From 2002, WrestleMania Axxess would be extended to a three-day event (March 14–16) and would be held at the Canadian National Exhibition.  The three-day event included similar activities to that of the one-day line-up.  In 2007, WrestleMania Axxess went on tour around cities in both the United States and Canada. In recent years, Axxess has become a four day event, with one session on Thursday, Friday and Sunday, and 3 sessions on Saturday.

Hope this helps.
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Offline Kotzenjunge

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #107 on: April 06, 2017, 09:42:51 AM »
Yes, as far back as the late 80s there were events outside of the card itself with increasing complexity as time went on. They tried to use them for some minor angles in those early days I think, with some jawjacking between opponents at the brunch or whatever.

Offline CookieMueller

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #108 on: April 06, 2017, 10:16:45 AM »
Yeah, that helps, thanks.

The fucking Trump Organization...

Offline strummer

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #109 on: April 06, 2017, 11:27:31 AM »
I can remember them hyping the "Fan Fest" for WM 10 very hard on TV

Offline Baby Shoes

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #110 on: April 06, 2017, 12:30:12 PM »
I can remember them hyping the "Fan Fest" for WM 10 very hard on TV

Yup.  I remember them showing a video of it during the show as a kid and I was so jealous of the people standing with cardboard cutouts and looking at displays of Hasbro figures behind glass cases with Hillbilly Jim looking on.  Kamala referenced it in the non-WWE Wrestlemania weekend thread.
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Offline Epic for the Summer

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #111 on: April 06, 2017, 01:00:41 PM »
Axxess in its current form started with Wrestlemania 2000. They would usually airs clips of it during the actual Mania broadcast and eventually, like comic con, it became too big to confine to just two days. What I'm more interested in is when the location of WM became a hotbed for other promotions and non-WWE stars to cash in on.

Offline Hawk 34

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #112 on: April 06, 2017, 01:17:40 PM »
Axxess in its current form started with Wrestlemania 2000. They would usually airs clips of it during the actual Mania broadcast and eventually, like comic con, it became too big to confine to just two days. What I'm more interested in is when the location of WM became a hotbed for other promotions and non-WWE stars to cash in on.

I feel that aspect truly began at WMXX in NYC which allowed various northeast independent promotions such as ROH to run events to cater to that audience and the success of that weekend created a larger market for smaller promotions and talent based interaction to become a popular part of the WM week experience.   It also helped greatly starting​ at WM23 when WWE internally decided all WMs to follow would be major stadium venues meaning a larger audience would be guaranteed to be in the host city.

Offline Kahran Ramsus

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #113 on: April 06, 2017, 01:30:10 PM »
Yes, as far back as the late 80s there were events outside of the card itself with increasing complexity as time went on. They tried to use them for some minor angles in those early days I think, with some jawjacking between opponents at the brunch or whatever.

The main thing I remember about the early ones was Mr. Fuji doing the run in his suit.

Quote from: strummer
I can remember them hyping the "Fan Fest" for WM 10 very hard on TV

Yeah, they did an episode of WWF Mania from there and everything.

Offline The Valeyard

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #114 on: April 06, 2017, 01:36:08 PM »
The WM10 home video had some footage of the Undertaker and Paul Bearer doing photo ops without explanation. I thought that was fun.

Offline Epic for the Summer

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #115 on: April 11, 2017, 01:44:25 AM »
Other than Wrestlemanias, how many times did BikerTaker perform the Tombstone?

Offline Baby Shoes

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #116 on: April 11, 2017, 03:01:06 AM »
I feel like that was during the overall piledriver ban so it didn't really happen.  Which was probably best for his knees anyway as everyone kept talking about how old he was then... fifteen years ago.  Then when he switched back to Dead Man they let him or people in his matches do it, IIRC
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Offline Aero

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #117 on: April 11, 2017, 09:29:35 AM »
Other than Wrestlemanias, how many times did BikerTaker perform the Tombstone?

I think he used it for a few weeks after returning in 2000 but quickly switched to the Last Ride, and otherwise only used it at WM, as mentioned. Speaking of which, I always thought it was a shame that the finish to the HHH match at WM 17 was the corner Last Ride spot instead of the Tombstone reversal spot from minutes earlier, which was actually special because he hadn't used it in so long.

Offline THE WARREN WARRIOR

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #118 on: April 11, 2017, 09:31:05 AM »
Other than Wrestlemanias, how many times did BikerTaker perform the Tombstone?

he did it to Shane O'Mac at Survivor Series 01. He may have hit it on Brock during one of their 02/03 matches.

Offline THE TUGSTER

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #119 on: April 11, 2017, 09:32:51 AM »
2003 Rumble
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Offline Kotzenjunge

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #120 on: April 13, 2017, 11:48:05 AM »
You know what's weird when you bump into it? Promos and awkward tie-in segments for the time period. I'm in mid-late 2001 WWE and finally had to skip something (despite my want to drink in every old detail) when the Planet of the Apes Jericho/Stephanie segment came on. Good lord. I want to go back and watch the Federline/Cena build and match because I remember being legitimately excited about it at the time and even had some non-fans wanting to watch Raw with me that night. I think that whole feud qualifies as old now. Shit, it was old within six months of happening as WWE actually managed to capture something when it was at its peak of pop cultural relevance for once.

Other observation that someone else has made maybe: I've been trying to figure out why things look more exciting and crowds seem hotter back in the day. You know what's missing now? Flashbulbs. Fucking flashbulbs make for great visuals and help a new viewer figure out what's a big deal and what isn't.

Offline The Amazing Rando

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #121 on: April 13, 2017, 12:07:14 PM »
Other observation that someone else has made maybe: I've been trying to figure out why things look more exciting and crowds seem hotter back in the day. You know what's missing now? Flashbulbs. Fucking flashbulbs make for great visuals and help a new viewer figure out what's a big deal and what isn't.

I have this image of Bray Wyatt and his legion of flashbulbs. (although, this would totes work for The Fashion Police)
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Offline Kotzenjunge

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #122 on: April 13, 2017, 12:11:54 PM »
I'll see you that and say back then it would have been lighters. People would buy lighters just to go to the shows, I bet. Cheap and fun and it would look pretty sweet too, why not?

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Offline The Amazing Rando

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #123 on: April 13, 2017, 12:18:20 PM »
I'll see you that and say back then it would have been lighters. People would buy lighters just to go to the shows, I bet. Cheap and fun and it would look pretty sweet too, why not?

BOOSH OLD SCHOOL'D

I kinda miss, like, Taker's "creatures of the night" themed fans. I doubt it would work well in this era but I'd love to see something like that with the Wyatts, or Demon Balor, or even a group like the Fashion Police or Enzo/Cass. Them two having some over the top Jersey girls in the front row would be fantastic.
A Horrible Premise - Episode 48: TEN CORGIS TAPED TOGETHER - an improv comedy game show podcast about creating 'horrible' tv shows.

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Offline The Valeyard

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #124 on: April 13, 2017, 01:53:14 PM »
So was the intention of the New Generation wrestling plumbers and hockey players and trash men and all designed to get the characters actually over enough to draw, or just to exist? Like did Vince really see Bill Irwin and think he could be the next big thing if he was the Goon, for example? I never got the intention completely. Did he want a wacky wrestling trashman, or did he want an over wrestling trashman who was a threat to guys like Bret?

Offline Love Harnesser Kamala

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #125 on: April 13, 2017, 03:32:57 PM »
Jericho goes into the genesis behind characters like TL Hopper, The Goon, and Duke Droese in his first book. Apparently, Cornette told him they wanted enhancement guys that had more personality than normal job guys but weren't big enough names to go over name dudes.

Also it would've been weird if Jericho ended up playing The Goon as I'm assuming that was character WWE wanted Jericho to play in '96.

Offline The Valeyard

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #126 on: April 13, 2017, 03:57:38 PM »
Jericho would've done good enough for a future repackaging, I think. Dope Rock Star Jericho, true protege of the Honky Tonk Man, would've been fun stuff.

Offline Love Harnesser Kamala

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #127 on: April 13, 2017, 04:06:56 PM »
You know Jericho really would've done a PRETTY GOOD JOB in the Rockabilly gimmick now that I think about it.

Offline TheSSNintendo

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #128 on: April 14, 2017, 09:12:27 AM »
Other than Wrestlemanias, how many times did BikerTaker perform the Tombstone?

He gave Brother Love a Tombstone on an episode of Smackdown in '03.

Offline Kahran Ramsus

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #129 on: April 14, 2017, 10:55:10 AM »
Jericho goes into the genesis behind characters like TL Hopper, The Goon, and Duke Droese in his first book. Apparently, Cornette told him they wanted enhancement guys that had more personality than normal job guys but weren't big enough names to go over name dudes.

Also it would've been weird if Jericho ended up playing The Goon as I'm assuming that was character WWE wanted Jericho to play in '96.

I don't think that's true of Droese.  He was more of an opening match face than an enhancement talent, and he came around long before the WWF went on that recruitment drive for "name jobbers" in 1996 that Goon, Hopper, Freddie Joe Floyd, etc. were a part of.

Offline CanadianGuitarist

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #130 on: April 14, 2017, 11:55:46 AM »
Other observation that someone else has made maybe: I've been trying to figure out why things look more exciting and crowds seem hotter back in the day. You know what's missing now? Flashbulbs. Fucking flashbulbs make for great visuals and help a new viewer figure out what's a big deal and what isn't.

THIS. I take some heat for still having a proper camera (as opposed to just using my phone to take photos), but in addition to optical zoom, there's just a je ne sais quoi to owning a camera still; perhaps the flashbullb aspect plays a role.

You know what's weird when you bump into it? Promos and awkward tie-in segments for the time period. I'm in mid-late 2001 WWE and finally had to skip something (despite my want to drink in every old detail) when the Planet of the Apes Jericho/Stephanie segment came on. Good lord. I want to go back and watch the Federline/Cena build and match because I remember being legitimately excited about it at the time and even had some non-fans wanting to watch Raw with me that night. I think that whole feud qualifies as old now. Shit, it was old within six months of happening as WWE actually managed to capture something when it was at its peak of pop cultural relevance for once.

The "Trump vs Rosie" thing from Raw in early '07 (even with President Trump's current prominence) has probably aged badly, let alone it was the most ashamed I ever remember being as a wrestling fan.

Offline Kotzenjunge

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #131 on: April 14, 2017, 01:14:59 PM »
Is that just assuming that Katie Vick is everyone's #1 time they were most ashamed to be a fan?

Offline THE WARREN WARRIOR

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #132 on: April 14, 2017, 02:08:26 PM »
This is up there for me


Offline Brodypedia

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #133 on: April 14, 2017, 04:28:00 PM »
http://culturecrossfire.com/wrestling/msg122884/

We return to MSG for a historic night of action as the first "Road to Wrestlemania" begins as Roddy Piper storms into a Capt. Lou Albano and Cyndi Lauper ceremony and causes chaos. The Hulkster battles the Iron Sheik, Jack Brisco competes in one of his final matches as the Briscos grapple with Dick Murdoch and Adrian Adonis, Tonga Kid and Superfly Snuka have a wild match with Bob Orton and Roddy Piper, top international junior heavyweights the Cobra and the Black Tiger try and win over the crowd, JYD has some unexpected issues with a jobber and more action!

Offline Saints_Fan_H

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #134 on: April 15, 2017, 03:29:55 AM »
Is that just assuming that Katie Vick is everyone's #1 time they were most ashamed to be a fan?
Eugene was pretty rough for me. My grandfather was "Eugene" and my cousin is mentally handicapped. And somehow my wrestling hating dad walked in on that segment shook his head and walked off. I forget what the whole sum of that RAW was but there was a commercial break, I went piss, and found him on the other TV with the same USA commercial I just walked away from. Fucker went put it on WWE to watch the handicapped wrestler with his father's name  >:(

Offline Kahran Ramsus

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #135 on: April 15, 2017, 03:41:12 AM »
The worst for me, aside from exploiting real life tragedies like the Melanie Pillman thing, was probably the Tim White suicide skits, especially the first one where they played it completely straight.

Offline Epic for the Summer

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #136 on: April 15, 2017, 03:43:23 AM »
The two most horrific things WWE ever did that never get talked about are the Melanie Pillman intervew and Taker beating the shit out of Kanyon (who for some reason was dressed like Boy George) on TV.

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #137 on: April 15, 2017, 03:55:29 AM »
The Suicidal Tim White bits were so baffling and dark that I actually find myself unable to stop laughing when I think about them now. I mean, who was that even supposed to help? Was the payoff going to be Tim White beating up a defective noose in a match and declaring to the arena that he really DOES want to live now?

Offline BorneAgain

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #138 on: April 15, 2017, 04:14:20 AM »
The Tim White stuff screamed Vince or someone high up doubling down when they saw the offended reaction to the original segment.

Its kind of amazing to recall how brazen the company was even after the attention from Eddie's death but before the spotlight from Benoit tragedy. The suicide bits, the Eddiesploitation, the live sex celebration stuff with Edge/Lita, DX's skits, etc.

As much flack as WWE gets for going PG, its not like there were always making great TV with more mature content anyway.

Offline Kahran Ramsus

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #139 on: April 15, 2017, 06:01:41 AM »
The Tim White stuff screamed Vince or someone high up doubling down when they saw the offended reaction to the original segment.

It felt to me like it was originally meant to be totally serious and that they had to turn it into a comedy and show Tim White still alive because of the backlash.

Offline Richard

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #140 on: April 16, 2017, 03:36:48 PM »
I'd say it was probably Val Venis getting castrated, but really a lot of shit from 98-99 could apply.

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #141 on: April 17, 2017, 02:41:02 AM »
I was watching some old TNA for the first time and saw a couple of very good Gail Kim vs Taryn Terrell matches. Is Gail Kim the best women's wrestler ever, in terms of in-ring ability, or does Taryn Terrell go on to become some amazing talent?

Offline Baby Shoes

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #142 on: April 17, 2017, 03:34:59 AM »
Taryn and Brooke Tessmacher are two that WWE wouldn't even let in the ring that came along and became very solid workers in TNA.
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Offline Epic for the Summer

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #143 on: April 17, 2017, 05:04:29 AM »
Taryn/Gail Last Woman Standing was legit one of the best matches that year (2013?).

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #144 on: April 17, 2017, 08:58:49 AM »
It was 2013 and was followed up by a not quite as awesome, but still very good ladder match between the two. It just felt like Gail was a miracle worker but maybe I'm underestimating former ECW GM Tiffany.

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #145 on: April 17, 2017, 09:42:44 AM »
Gail kicked herself into high gear once she was allowed to work with actual wrestlers and not just fitness models.

Offline Epic for the Summer

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #146 on: April 17, 2017, 10:57:41 AM »
It was 2013 and was followed up by a not quite as awesome, but still very good ladder match between the two. It just felt like Gail was a miracle worker but maybe I'm underestimating former ECW GM Tiffany.

Gail certainly shined but Terrell had improved a ton by that point. The bumps both women took, espeially Taryn who no one thought was capable of taking that type of punishment, definately helped sell the intensity. Still one of my top 10 women's bouts of the decade.

Offline Brodypedia

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #147 on: April 18, 2017, 01:28:31 AM »
http://culturecrossfire.com/wrestling/njpwclassics33/

"New Japan Classics 33" featuring Antonio Inoki facing off with Abdullah the Butcher, the Masked Superstar and Bad News Allen. WWF Junior Heavyweight champion Tatsumi Fujinami collides with NWA Junior Heavyweight champion Les Thornton, plus Tiger Mask clashes with one of Mexico's top luchadores, Roland Boch and more!!

Offline Kotzenjunge

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #148 on: April 18, 2017, 07:05:33 AM »


Maybe this should have gone into the videos thread, but I found myself laughing uncontrollably at how mismanaged WCW became and had to share this. I never listen to whatever show this is, so sorry if I'm sharing an old gag!

Offline Saints_Fan_H

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Re: Old School Observations/Questions, 2017 Edition
« Reply #149 on: April 19, 2017, 12:32:33 AM »
Not detailed enough for wrestling dreams thread, but WCW Saturday Night was in my dream last night. And damn I really miss that show. The audio mix for what it was, the quaint set, and after Nitro started you got to see wrestlers not on Monday nights a lot. I guess at this point that ambience won't be recaptured. MAYBE a hair of it is in NXT.


I have no real point.