Old School Observations/Questions Thread 2020-21

[Epic Springs]

WCW did a show in Central Park during the Goodwill Games in '98 but I think that was more of an attraction than a paid show.

 

[BUTT]

Here are Meltzer's numbers for those WCW shows without listed attendance:
6/15/98: 14,254/13,381 paid ($426,105, Nassau record gate up to this point)
11/9/98: 13,891 ($419,160, sold out in three hours)
12/29/98: 12,323 ($398,990)
"Nitro on 9/25 at the Nassau Coliseum drew 4,898 fans total which was 2,815 paid for a gate of $113,390. It may have been the lowest paid attendance for a wrestling show in the history of the Nassau Coliseum and definitely was the lowest in the past 20 years. As best we can tell, the last time there was a major sized (10,000+ capacity) arena show in the New York City market that drew less than 3,000 paid would have been during the depression in the 1930s."

 

[alkeiper]

And now @alkeiper or someone might be able to talk about IWA running Jersey City in the '70s.

That’s a deep cut!

Someone needs to write a book about the IWA. Seriously, this group did draw 13,000 to Roosevelt Stadium which by all accounts was a dump. It looks like they mostly ran Crockett’s territory. They had some reasonable talents. If there’s a fun story with the USFL and other failed ventures, surely there’s some gold behind the IWA.

 

[King Kamala]

Is anyone still alive that would enjoy meeting this trio? Is there anyone in the afterlife that would enjoy meeting this trio!?

 

[alkeiper]

DeNucci is 89. I could absolutely see the merits of that one.

 

[King Kamala]

Yeah. I had assumed Dominic DeNucci was dead before seeing this flyer. He has to be one of the only living WWWF era guys left.

 

[Sex Machine Gun]

"ALL TIME GREAT"

"JOURNEY MAN"

"IRISH"

 

[BruiserBrody]

Yeah. I had assumed Dominic DeNucci was dead before seeing this flyer. He has to be one of the only living WWWF era guys left.

They sure ain't getting any younger!
Dibiase, Iron Sheik, Handsome Jimmy, Kevin Sullivan, Backlund, Garea, Larry Z, Fujnami, Inoki, Sakaguchi, Strong Kobayashi, Mascaras, Superstar Graham, Patera, Kabuki (as Mr Sato), Steve Keirn, Putski, Carlos Colon, Jose Gonzalez, Stan Hansen, Baron VR, Billy White Wolf (Adnan), Greg Gagne, Pete Doherty, Bugsy McGraw, etc etc

 

[alkeiper]

Denucci even pre-dates all of those guys, he worked the OLD Madison Square Garden in the ‘60s. Johnny Rodz is still around from that era, so is Spiros Arion. Probably not many others.

 

[Valeyard]

I forgot Denucci was still alive. Was he any good?

I'd go out of my way to see any event Arion and Rodz were at. Two of my personal favorites.

 

[Super Leather]

I feel like I've seen Dom DeNucci doing jobber duty on '70s-era All-Star Wrestling. No better or worse than Johnny Rodz or the other job squad regulars of the time.

 

[Super Leather]

DeNucci knows his role in this MSG match against the Incredible Hulk Hogan.

DeNucci teams up with the late "Quick Draw" Rick McGraw for jobber duty against the Moondogs as managed by Captain Lou Albano.

 

[BUTT]

Surprised that Kamala doesn't know about the 2017 Washington Post article in which Denucci calls Obama a racial slur and says "I hope that [expletive] dies in office" but I'm sorry to report that this old bitch has been cancelled. (I don't know why the nation's second most prestigious newspaper devoted space to reporting on why Shane Douglas and his trainer voted for Trump but there were approximately 56,000 other articles between 2016 and 2018 profiling individual white people and their inscrutable choice to vote Republican, so I guess it's not that out of place.)

 

[King Kamala]

Somehow I totally missed the "inside the mind of Trump supporters" puff piece featuring Shane Douglas. But did I really "miss" anything?

I always forget about WWE's '00s retail store in Niagara Falls. It was open somehow until 2011!

 

[alkeiper]

It certainly makes me less likely to cancel my camping trip to attend a Dominic Denucci autograph signing in Hamburg, PA, that's for certain. Next I'm going to find out Ken Jugan has regressive attitudes towards minorities too and I don't think my fandom can take that.

 

[King Kamala]

Irish Davey O'Hannon though you know has to have some really regressive viewpoints.

 

[King Kamala]

Brockumentary Chapter Five: Show Time

Brock Lesnar was originally going to face Hulk Hogan at Survivor Series 2002 but as the old saying goes: plans change.

www.voicesofwrestling.com

I either didn't know or long forgot that Brock Lesnar Vs Hulk Hogan was the original plan for Survivor Series '02.

It's too bad that WWE honestly probably DID overjob Hogan cause I feel like cleanly beating Undertaker and Hulk Hogan in back to back PPV epics really would have solidified Brock Lesnar's legacy. He's just had a real disappointing career since (eyerolls). And I forgot how corny Big Show's sudden elevation to main event was but ya know what? It almost kind of worked to me as a budding smark. It was super rushed and I can't say it was entirely successful but Big Show's treatment during this era felt like "Yeah...that's how he should have been booked all along."

 

[strummer]

I had completely forgotten Heyman managed Big Show in late 2002/early 2003. I can't even remember how they broke them up or if it just ended when Heyman was fired in February 2003

 

[Valeyard]

Show going from losing to Jeff Hardy in the Raw midcard to beating Brock was such bullshit at the time. It saved his career, yeah, but the jeans-era Show just wasn't the best guy at the time. Not even Heyman telling Brock he couldn't win in the buildup I think it ended with Heyman moving on to Angle/Team Angle for a brief period.

Hogan wanted his win back and Vince said no so Hogan fucked off for a few months. Brock's total destruction of Hulkamania is still a career highlight.

 

[King Kamala]

Sudden babyface turn for Brock didn't really help anything tbh. Yeah, he got cheers in the NYC area but that's New York, baby, they're a bunch of lunatics. Brock's someone that should never really be a face (and afaik, I don't think he HAS been a face since 2003, right?). Alternately, I think WWE could have turned Angle face years earlier then they did and reversed the dynamics of his and Lesnar's feud. Hell, you could even put Haas & Benjamin with Brock and make it Team Lesnar instead!

 

[Sex Machine Gun]

He was definitely a face against Rollins in Summer 2015 before transitioning to someone who was cheered but did nothing to solicit them besides badass stuff against Undertaker for their return feud.

 

[Valeyard]

Brock can and could fit any role. He's not going to get booed but he also can't get cheered if he wants. He's got the asshole jock thing where he's an asshole but holy shit he's really good and you want him on your team. From day one he was just a star like that from his look alone. Guy just will get cheered less vs getting booed.

 

[Valeyard]

That sprint with Show at Survivor Series is really good too.

 

[King Kamala]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1417951422822354944

Um...I think I answered my own question of "Did anyone seem more instantly older and washed up then '96 and on Bobby Eaton?" with 1993 and on Barry Windham. He is 38 in that picture but might as well be 60.

Edit:

NWA Championship Wrestling America « Events Database « CAGEMATCH - The Internet Wrestling Database

Internet Wrestling Database

www.cagematch.net

Indy cards you wouldn't think existed if you hadn't found them on Cagematch thread crosspost. Is there a more random triple threat than Doug Gilbert Vs Barry Windham Vs Rocco Rock???

 

[King Kamala]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1420856646146854914

Tbh though. Idk see difference between Cornette using Elton John as hip and cool music and fact Tony Khan using the Pixies as hip and cool music. In fact, I feel like we are further away from Pixies' peak in relevancy than this SMW video was from Elton John's cool peak...

 

[Lazgistics Supervisor]

Yeah, covering people in tar, that liquid hot magma shit they used to pave roads that can melt your skin off, ain't fucking edgy!

 

[Hawk 34]

Pfft, maybe if they dunked a basketball it would been edgier.

 

[King Kamala]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1421138307128471558

 

[BruiserBrody]

I'm watching my DVD of the Dec 85 MSG show and Brian Blair is in some hot singles action with the Anvil. Only notable because Capt Lou Albano is randomly with Blair at the start. Apparently he was providing some pointers to help the Bee man hurt a potential challenger for the Bulldogs.

Bonus LULZ for some well dressed Guidos giving Neidhart the business at ringside.

Edit: Now I am cracking myself up thinking of Vince punishing Lou for being a drunk by making him manage in John Belushi's Bee Costume.

Match stunk BTW.

Edit 2: Hercules amused me by doing the Bruiser Brody foot stomps and even let out a guttural sound like a "Huss!" - he then turned around and calmly shook hands with Classy Freddy.

- Ron Shaw looks like Bill Watts with better cardio but worse steroids. He and SD Jones find a cure for the fan's insomnia.

- Lanny Poffo of all people dunks on Adrian Adonis' gimmick in his pre-match poem. Lord Al talks about how Adonis was doing shoot fights with fans in Texas in his younger days. Careful Al, Vince doesn't want anyone to talk about the other guys. Monsoon claims Adonis gained weight so his DDT (called a bulldog by Gorilla) will have more impact. ---- Fake News by Brody, after several months of finishing with the DDT, Adonis does actually use the bulldog to end things here.

Monsoon debates what Jesse Ventura thinks of his old partner's new gimmick. Now I wish Vince to "punished" Jesse for the union talk a few months after this by making him Adonis' gay lover manager.

The ref stops Adonis' heel moves and Gorilla complains!! Monsoon, you always say "Com'n Ref! Do your job!" The fans were way into Poffo since they apparently were that repulsed by Adonis.

Macho Man faces the Hulkster. 7 months earlier Macho was in bumfuck, Tennessee and now he probably earned his monthly Memphis wage in one night here in MSG. AWFUL finish as Macho KO's the Hulk with the title and then orders the ref to count him out. Savage then grabs the title and celebrates. Macho is stunned that this doesn't make him the new champ. Ugh. Hogan cleans his clock and does some half hearted posing.

Big John Studd botches a line early in his promo and it clearly shakes him as he then messes up 2 or 3 times more. Jimmy Brunzell is sporting a full beard for his promo. Clearly prepping for that heel turn on Greg Gagne that Verne wouldn't agree to.

Studd and Tony Atlas goes on FOREVER. Then midgets....doing midget things....for far too long.

Brunzell/Bret Hart gives us a workrate match after 2 hours of mostly rest holds. During a headlock in the match Gorilla mentions that it's one of the favorite holds of the modern roster. NO SHIT.

We end with Hillbillies vs the Dream Team. WWF knew Hogan vs Savage was likely to sell all the tickets (and did) but christ this show abused the paying fan. New Yawkers losing their shit over Hillbilly Jim is always a sight to behold.

Overall, I have to say I continue to be impressed/surprised that these WWF audiences will sit through trash, chant "boring!" and then pop for the babyfaces winning regardless.

 

[King Kamala]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1422939999943680002

I know what we got in reality is way better but man, it's fun to imagine Jon Moxley in 3MB for some reason.