Xenogears.

[Star Ocean 2]

Over 10 years, and still nothing has come close. The epic scope, character relationships, perfect soundtrack, none of that has been matched. It probably never will be.

Put aside the "best RPG ever" talk, for Xenogears has transcended video games, allowing itself into the discussion of most brilliant anything ever. What has been expressed here can be discussed along with any symphony, sculpture, or reality show as a legitimate piece of art. Everything comes together so well. The large number of important characters are all treated very well, this was a true world, with different colors and races. Such beauty.

Xenogears.

 

[AndrewTS]

I'll bite.

Fuck Xenogears.

 

[Star Ocean 2]

AndrewTS is lazy.

 

[Psycho Penguin]

I reviewed this average overrated tripe on GameFAQs like 8 years ago. 4,000 words. Call that lazy.

Fuck Xenogears.

 

[Black Lushus]

Fuck Xenogears' second disc.

 

[AndrewTS]

AndrewTS is lazy.

The Xenogears developers were lazy. I am just being concise!

I've made peace on the matter since Xenosaga bombed so hard and most right-thinking people know now that Xenogears was never that good to begin with.

It's kind of interesting SO is no longer SO3.

 

[Star Ocean 2]

I only said that because of this - http://forums.thesmartmarks.com/index.php?showtopic=80469
No, I didn't remember it offhand, but revisited that thread to reminisce.

Don't know how you can call developers lazy when a 90 game is cut short because Square had potentially time or budget issues. I doubt they had the original intention to make it that way.

Xenosaga is really not related. Xenogears wasn't good to begin with, it was great from the start.

 

[tonyjaymz03]

xenogears was nothing special. It was like any other ps1 jrpg on the ps1 except, you know, not as good as the others.

so to keep up with the others....fuck xenogears

 

[Damaramu]

Xenogears still holds fond memories for me.

What were the Gears again? I remember there being some story behind what they were.

As for Xenosaga. Fuck that game. Seriously, write it down and tell me later. There was more talking in that than anything.

 

[Psycho Penguin]

Xenosaga is so awesome and it had SKIP SCENE OPTION for fucks sake. And the battle system was awesome.

Now Xenosaga 2, fuck THAT.

 

[Damaramu]

I just tried to remind myself of the Xenogears story via Wikipedia. Wow, I remember it being much easier to understand when I actually played the game. Wiki really messes it up. Or I'm just remembering wrong.

So Saga has nothing to do with Gears?

 

[Edwin]

Xenogears was about as enthralling as the rest of the traditionally-perceived-as-top-notch Square games for me when I played it, but it definitely got really confusing looking back at it. Second disc remains hilarious.

 

[Jer]

As for Xenosaga. Fuck that game. Seriously, write it down and tell me later. There was more talking in that than anything.

I wish Xenogears had more talking, so the player would be spared from its insufferable gameplay. Although then you'd be subjected to its insufferable slow text speed. A conundrum, hmm.

Worst game ever.

 

[tonyjaymz03]

dont know if this is the reception SO2 expected...

 

[Black Lushus]

I actually did like it up til cut scene-o-rama on disc 2. The story's way too convoluted for it's own good, too.

 

[BUTT]

Didn't Xenosaga have 45-minute cutscenes? And then Nintendo went and BOUGHT the developer who made it. That's so unlike them!

 

[Kageho]

The biggest problem with Xenogears is that its almost two different video games after you get by the first disc. The first disc is an absolute bliss, joy, and wonderfully done. The second disc is a thing that makes you bash your head against a wall, wondering "what did I do to deserve this?".

And I have actually gone back to play it and it falls sadly into the "good" game category now. I can't honestly call it great simply because that second disc totally ruins any and all experiences from the very first disc. I know that the game was cut short, there's no way you can't tell when you get to that second disc, but it really does just drag down the whole experience.

Also, Dama, when playing the game the story was and is very concise and easy to follow. Though it is as Wiki describes it as it was convuluted and so many different things going on all at once. But the game made all these things work. ...well, at least on the first disc.

For the record, the major cutscene without actually trying to speed it through on disc two is longer than 45 minutes. Its closer to an hour and a half.

SO, I'm not sure how you'd get a sequel for it. I know there was supposed to be 6 games, with Xenogears actually being the 5th in the story, but without the original group that did it, I can't see them doing.

 

[AndrewTS]

The biggest problem with Xenogears is that its almost two different video games after you get by the first disc. The first disc is an absolute bliss, joy, and wonderfully done. The second disc is a thing that makes you bash your head against a wall, wondering "what did I do to deserve this?".

I don't even agree on that front, but I appreciate the lack of hyperbole that characterizes most Xenogears fans. The dungeon design was broken, with the horrible jumping mechanics making it a pain to navigate. Freakin' ugly 2D visuals. Suikoden craps all over it, and hard. Doesn't matter if it's sorta-kinda 3D. If it looks *and* plays horribly, being able to spin the environment around doesn't help. The combos that were used in the on-foot battle system was neat in concept, but kind of underdone. Saga had a much smoother, way more solid battle system, but I couldn't stand anything else.

So Saga has nothing to do with Gears?

About as much as most RPG sequels. Citan and Shion are somehow related, and there's thematic elements borrowed from Zohar in both of them. Both are also loaded with as many weird and disjointed bits of religious symbolism as possible, but in Saga you can't blame the translation as easily.

 

[Psycho Penguin]

Xenogears was originally supposed to be Xenosaga Episode 5. I forget how thye were going to figure that out when they got to Episode 5. Remake Xenogears, maybe?

 

[AndrewTS]

Xenogears was originally supposed to be Xenosaga Episode 5. I forget how thye were going to figure that out when they got to Episode 5. Remake Xenogears, maybe?

Or a recap movie disc, or have you sit in a chair and recap it to you...

Sometimes the hubris present in that still shocks me. A planned trilogy is often pushing it. A 5 or 6 parter, though? Ugh.

Didn't Xenosaga have 45-minute cutscenes? And then Nintendo went and BOUGHT the developer who made it. That's so unlike them!

Yeah it did. Maybe Nintendo just wasn't sure how they would destroy gaming back then!

 

[Star Ocean 2]

Further cementing its perfection is that it has a sense of humor. What game can have a villain declare that he will create God with his own hands, and also include these nuggets of joy:

"Super Nacho Information? What's that?"

"Feels like you have sacked your saccules, and tickled your untricles enough for one lifetime!"

 

[Psycho Penguin]

Dude, FF7 had a lot of juvenille humor too. So did FF8. And every RPG ever made after FF7. Hell FF4-FF6 had it too. Don't be defending Xenogears with 2 lame jokes on screen cap.

 

[Star Ocean 2]

OK man, calm down. I'm not trying to defend the game, just continuing talking about why I like it.

 

[KOAB]

This game ain't no Suikoden... it ain't no Wild Arms, it ain't no Front Mission, and it's certainly not in the epic category of greatest game ever that Shadow Hearts is in.

Xenogears sucks; You disappoint

 

[ericmm]

Best thing about XenoSAGA was that card game

 

[KOAB]

I can't remember much about Xenosaga, except that it seemed like a twist it was leading towards in the story was robot child molestation.

 

[Star Ocean 2]

This game ain't no Suikoden... it ain't no Wild Arms, it ain't no Front Mission, and it's certainly not in the epic category of greatest game ever that Shadow Hearts is in.

Xenogears sucks; You disappoint

You've got nothing.

And I don't need to defend Xenogears, that's not why this thread was started. That'd be like a priest having a Mass to defend Christ. Some people say Xenogears is God's gift to gaming. I say no; it is gaming itself, or, on a broader scope, God manifested in a video game. It is the zenith of games, and everything since then has simply been a forlon attempt to match its beauty.

"Lacan! Live!"

 

[Psycho Penguin]

This game ain't no Suikoden... it ain't no Wild Arms, it ain't no Front Mission, and it's certainly not in the epic category of greatest game ever that Shadow Hearts is in.

Xenogears sucks; You disappoint

So we agree Shadow Hearts (well, Covenant, the first one is up there though) is the greatest game of all the times?

+1, sir.

 

[KOAB]

God doesn't exist and Xenogears is the proof.

 

[Star Ocean 2]

Doubting the existence of God certainly is a major element of Xenogears, yes.

Shadow Hearts is good, but just doesn't have it as far as being the greatest.