ROH in 2021 Thread: Now Moderately Less Problematic!

[Lazgistics Supervisor]

The better Danielson/Morishima match was the Final Battle '08 blowoff and I'll die on that hill.

Much love for including the CZW/ROH Cage of Death, though. My favorite match in ROH history.

 

[Valeyard]

#NeverForget

 

[King Kamala]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1472348945816948736

 

[HSJ]

Looking at that list, I would replace Joe/Punk 3 with Joe/Punk 2 which was the much better match. I would also take out Hero/AJ, BC vs Chaos, and Briscoes vs Rush/Lee. Those 3 are real head scratchers.

Easily can replace those with Bryan/Nigel, the Dragon Gate six man, and one of Joe/Aries, KOW/Briscoes, Punk/Aries, Richard/Edwards, London/Shane.

It's hard not to pick too many matches that are more than 10 years old at this point because there was such a long period where ROH was New Japan light and it doesn't feel right to put those matches on a ROH list. And then after that period was over, we got Matt Taven.

 

[Broward83]

#NeverForget

What. In. The. Fuck.

Who even thinks that's safe, or sane...?!

 

[Lazgistics Supervisor]

IIRC, it was supposed to be a top rope powerbomb into the ring, but BJ lost his footing.

 

[HSJ]

IIRC, it was supposed to be a top rope powerbomb into the ring, but BJ lost his footing.

But then they redid that spot in the rematch lol.

 

[Valeyard]

The second BJ's foot goes back, Jimmy's head turns to make sure he hits the buckle. I was freaked out bad and still am.

 

[Epic Springs]

I remember another super dangerous spot from an ROH show (might also involve BJ) where one dude top rope superplexed another into the crowd.

 

[King Kamala]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1472348945816948736

I'm surprised that people are surprised that a wrestler would want to try out for WWE? Like I know AEW has the hot hand right now in the USA but 60 or so years of being the top promotion in the country doesn't go away overnight. Also Rok-C is only 20 so she fits WWE developmental's current MO perfectly.

 

[Epic Springs]

She was also trained by Booker T who likely put in a good word for her.

 

[King Kamala]

Good news for the ROH fans here...are any of you here?

(tumbleweed rolls)

Anyway, Joe Koff is on the ROH podcast today and he says it's a matter of when not if ROH will be back.

ROH COO Joe Koff talks what Ring of Honor will be when — not if — it returns

Ring of Honor’s head honcho reflects on the bittersweet night at Final Battle: End of an Era, and gives fans some idea what the promotion will look in April... a comeback he promises is happening.

www.cagesideseats.com

 

[RedJed]

Well, that's reassuring......I'll be honest though, I thought there was no way they were coming back. And keep in mind Koff is going to be the guy to do that PR spin, if anyone is, if its still a work in progress and perhaps things aren't set fully by April. I'm still of the ilk of I'll believe it when I see it.

On the flip side, the company is still backed by a huge corporation who always has and always will probably treat ROH as a subsantial tax write off they can benefit from, and that probably won't change anytime soon. So they are willing to keep it afloat for their own personal reasons. Maybe not spend as much as before obviously, but still be "running"

 

[King Kamala]

If ROH can scale back and go back to how they were pre 2012, I don't think anyone would consider it to be anything but a blessing in disguise. But it's also hard to sell taking four months off in this current wrestling climate as a good thing.

 

[Big Beard Booty Daddy]

The only problem they fall into if they restart as a super indie is, who will really care? They have their name value, but between PWG, GCW, and other companies that stream on Fite and IWTV, where does that leave ROH? They'll just be using the same talent that is already out there, so they need something else to get people hooked.

 

[King Kamala]

I'm disappointed that they didn't stick to the presentation that they had when they returned in late summer/early fall last year with the Pure Tournament, hyping themselves as the purest, most technical based brand in North American wrestling. I think it was right direction for them to go in then and now.

Problem is that approach has limited mainstream appeal and ensures they'll be an indie forever. But ykw? ROH had the biggest non WWE names of past 20 years and were at MSG and still felt like an indie so frig it.

Potentially horrible idea I'll keep shouting (typing?) to the rooftops...ROH and GCW alliance. ROH has the infrastructure and production value, GCW has the buzz and cool factor. It could work dammit. Problem there is @Laz would potentially have his first stroke after they inevitably revive the ROH-CZW feud and involve Atticus Cogar.

 

[Lazgistics Supervisor]

If ROH can scale back and go back to how they were pre 2012, I don't think anyone would consider it to be anything but a blessing in disguise. But it's also hard to sell taking four months off in this current wrestling climate as a good thing.

The only problem they fall into if they restart as a super indie is, who will really care? They have their name value, but between PWG, GCW, and other companies that stream on Fite and IWTV, where does that leave ROH? They'll just be using the same talent that is already out there, so they need something else to get people hooked.

I'm disappointed that they didn't stick to the presentation that they had when they returned in late summer/early fall last year with the Pure Tournament, hyping themselves as the purest, most technical based brand in North American wrestling. I think it was right direction for them to go in then and now.

Problem is that approach has limited mainstream appeal and ensures they'll be an indie forever. But ykw? ROH had the biggest non WWE names of past 20 years and were at MSG and still felt like an indie so frig it.

There's your answer. Early ROH was heavily influenced by worked-shoot and the NOAH Junior style, and there's no reason to believe that a modernization of that approach couldn't work if done well. Bloodsport is regularly one of the more popular WM Weekend shows, right? And there are worked-shoot companies gaining more steam again in Japan?

Boom. At least you'll be carving a niche again instead of playing catch-up with all of the spot-focused companies that you directly influenced.

 

[Lazgistics Supervisor]

And fuck your stupid GCW alliance idea, @King Kamala Holidays

 

[Valeyard]

Jimmy Jacobs was so ahead of the game. Even better with time.

 

[RedJed]

I think the CGW/ROH alliance or maybe even some interpromotional thing isnt that far away, since ROH is already fully engaged in doing business with them it might already be happening other than some sort of invasion angle on one or the other, or both.

We already saw Effy and AJ Gray in an ROH ring, and the Briscoes are still running hard as tag champs in both companies. The match they had with PCO and Brody King at the GCW show this past weekend was great.

Gresham defended the ROH title in a pure match just this weekend, and is also set to take on Blake Christian at Hammerstein. Frankly, I wouldn't be shocked if a decent influx of pure wrestlers "invade" the Hammerstein show, leading to some sort of low key ROH vs CGW thing coming up.

 

[HSJ]

I absolutely see a clear path for ROH to return to its glory days, but it involves the proverbial forbidden door and working with PWG, Impact, GCW, and AEW (plus international talent).

Let Gresham, Briscoes, Rok-C and The Righteous defend the titles on the Indies. Let the World title be a World Title again and defend it everywhere (you know Gresham would).

Sure, some people have favorites and people they dislike, but can you imagine a world where MJF shows up to challenge Gresham for the ROH title? Or a GCW/ROH feud similar to the CZW wars? How about the Righteous showing up on AEW for a month with the six man titles?

The worst thing to happen to ROH was signing people to contracts and having a set roster. They have the production and money to become that "dream match" indie again, but the only question I have is how much will Sinclaire allow?

 

[King Kamala]

Listened to the ROHStrong podcast with Joe Koff on my lunchbreak and Joe Koff has such overwhelmed assistant principal energy. Which is funny cause Cary Silkin has drunk, laid back assistant principal energy (which I guess would make Gabe Sapolsky the assistant principal that got fired for fighting with the school board too much then went to work for some sleazy charter school and RF the assistant principal that got fired for breaking a creep)

 

[Lazgistics Supervisor]

Or a GCW/ROH feud similar to the CZW wars?

That would feel forced on multiple levels. The ROH/CZW feud was about diametrically opposing viewpoints on wrestling as a sport, and attracted different parts of the indie audience: one wanted American puro, one wanted ultraviolence. That isn't to say that there wasn't considerable overlap, both in talents and fanbase, but they represented different ends of the fan spectrum. That the program worked as well as it did, and even saw CZW winning on a moral level (as it took the ROH locker room going ultraviolent to actually win), is still a miracle, and stands as the shining moment of Gabe as a booker.

The worst thing to happen to ROH was signing people to contracts and having a set roster. They have the production and money to become that "dream match" indie again, but the only question I have is how much will Sinclaire allow?

100%, but it was a necessity due to how often WWE and TNA would snag up talent just as they were either getting pushes or in the middle of one.

Should ROH continue, the "forbidden door" is wide open, and they shouldn't shy away from it. Instead? Embrace ROH as the utmost proving ground for "real" pro wrestlers. Focus on being a showcase again instead of the "just another wrestling show" slump it fell from the Cornette era onward. Embrace the lower budget and smaller venues, make it a prestige (both in and out of kayfabe) to work in the same ring that catapulted Bryan, Joe, Punk, Rollins, Owens, Zayn, and so many others into the mainstream.

I love the idea of talent defending the ROH belts around the world, in and out of different companies. Gresham defending the World title at Bloodsport, the Briscoes laying waste to FTR and the Bucks to keep the Tag belts theirs, Rok-C taking on Statlander and Britt and whoever else. All gold.

 

[King Kamala]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1474224177104179204

Leave the memories alone. Seriously. Knock it off. Leave them alone.