Something's wrong with Ric Flair

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

And if he's not racist now (as events would indicate)...

Which events would those be, incidentally?

Do you want me to link you two hour interviews that nobody here is gonna watch anyway?

I'm genuinely curious: did Flair ever publicly renounce his racist past, and does he have any receipts to show that he has worked to become an ally for POC, or are we just assuming that he's not a racist anymore, because he stopped saying racist shit out loud?

 

[909]

And if he's not racist now (as events would indicate)...

Which events would those be, incidentally?

Do you want me to link you two hour interviews that nobody here is gonna watch anyway?

I'm genuinely curious: did Flair ever publicly renounce his racist past, and does he have any receipts to show that he has worked to become an ally for POC, or are we just assuming that he's not a racist anymore, because he stopped saying racist shit out loud?

I am assuming he's not a racist anymore because of how he treats people now, and all the stories about him doing so.

But no, he did not renounce his racist past, and considering he was only accused of doing things (which I believe) without any proof of it, there's an obvious reason he wouldn't acknowledge it. People are quite brazen about this kind of thing now, and if that's how he is there would be no reason to not come out with it.

 

[Sabre]

I love how flair being on his apparent death bed has resulted in a flame war on racism.

What happened to people just mourning a childhood hero regardless of his personal beliefs.

 

[Wacko Walrus]

If Ric Flair is such a racist, then how come he jobbed to Shelton Benjamin?

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

I love how flair being on his apparent death bed has resulted in a flame war on racism.

What happened to people just mourning a childhood hero regardless of his personal beliefs.

[list type=decimal]
[*]I didn't know that people actually did that; I thought that people who learned that their childhood heroes had problematic beliefs disavowed them as their heroes. I guess I've been doing it wrong this whole time.

[*]The closest thing I have to a childhood hero in wrestling is Dusty Rhodes, and even that's only because my grandma was responsible for getting me into wrestling, and she was a huge Dusty mark. I was not anywhere near as big a Dusty fan as she was. It was sort of how like my son was with the Kings: he would cheer whenever the Kings did something good, because it made me happy, but he didn't actually care, one way or the other.
[/list]

When Flair dies, if this becomes an "in memoriam" thread, or if another one is created for that purpose, then I would agree with keeping such a discussion out of it. But, he's not dead yet, and his past is kind of relevant to how some of us remember him.

 

[BruiserBrody]

You guys must really hate Lawler.

And Bill Watts.

And David Schultz

And Hogan

And Harley Race

And Hawk

And Michael Hayes

And Andre

And the Warrior

And Ole Anderson

And Bill Demott

And Vince McMahon

And HHH

And Don Muraco

And Jesse Ventura

And Mr. Fuji

And Roddy Piper

And so on.

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

But... what if I really don't fuck with any of those guys, though?

 

[909]

The closest thing I have to a childhood hero in wrestling is Dusty Rhodes, and even that's only because my grandma was responsible for getting me into wrestling, and she was a huge Dusty mark. I was not anywhere near as big a Dusty fan as she was. It was sort of how like my son was with the Kings: he would cheer whenever the Kings did something good, because it made me happy, but he didn't actually care, one way or the other.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwRm18GleAM

I think that expecting people of that generation to be pure of heart is more than a bit silly.

But this thread, as has already been said, has been massively hijacked.

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

The closest thing I have to a childhood hero in wrestling is Dusty Rhodes, and even that's only because my grandma was responsible for getting me into wrestling, and she was a huge Dusty mark. I was not anywhere near as big a Dusty fan as she was. It was sort of how like my son was with the Kings: he would cheer whenever the Kings did something good, because it made me happy, but he didn't actually care, one way or the other.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwRm18GleAM

I think that expecting people of that generation to be pure of heart is more than a bit silly.

And you know what? I believe it. Like I said, Dusty was grandma's hero, not mine.

 

[Smartly Pretty]

[bunch of names]

Uh, yeah, wrestling has historically had a race problem. And you can either be an adult and tackle that issue or you can stick your fingers in your ears when it comes time to talk about it.

People spent a lot of time on this board trying to figure out how we could have elected a racist as president. Now we're in a situation where people want to excuse the racist behaviors of Ric Flair because we liked to watch him on television? Do you not think these things are related?

 

[BruiserBrody]

The time to talk about it is when he's in coma? Should I start a thread for each so we can talk about how horrible they were since we're all triggered?

----

https://www.si.com/extra-mustard/2017/08/17/ric-flair-heath-update

There has been a flurry of inaccurate reports regarding the condition of Flair, who is a resident of Atlanta, Georgia. Per a source close to the family, Flair did not undergo heart surgery nor did he suffer a heart attack. Upon medical attention, what was thought to be an intestinal blockage wound up requiring part of his bowel be removed.

--

I read elsewhere that the worst part is over for him, and his recovery is probable

 

[cobainwasmurdered]

MelindaMorrisZanoni‏
@LegacyTalentCEO
Follow
More
Happy 2 report @RicFlairNatrBoy is awake, communicating & progressing..but there are complications so needs rest for the 1st time in 40 yrs
5:15 PM - 19 Aug 2

 

[BUTT]

https://twitter.com/RicFlairNatrBoy/status/904045165584818176

Ric Flair®‏Verified account @RicFlairNatrBoy

I'm Backkkk! Thanks To Everyone For The Support These Past Couple Weeks. I Ain't Dead Yet Mother F**ckers! WOOOOO! http://RicFlairShop.com

I'm Backkkk!

:-X

 

[Shooting Star]

You guys must really hate Lawler.

And Bill Watts.

And David Schultz

And Hogan

And Harley Race

And Hawk

And Michael Hayes

And Andre

And the Warrior

And Ole Anderson

And Bill Demott

And Vince McMahon

And HHH

And Don Muraco

And Jesse Ventura

And Mr. Fuji

And Roddy Piper

And so on.

Didn't Watts love black people and made Simmons champ in WCW to draw more?

 

[cobainwasmurdered]

Lol he was one of the biggest racists in wrestling. He just liked money more.

 

[Shooting Star]

Got it. Guess I misinterpreted the events as him being a big supporter of diversity in wrestling instead of just being a businessman looking for ways to make more money.

 

[BruiserBrody]

I don't think Watts was overtly racist past the "standard" southern stereotype stuff. Unless I'm forgetting some of the interview, the comments that got him in trouble were more hard right business > individual rights in nature compared to something a Dick Murdoch might have said in the same era.

The standard line of thinking was a lot more brutal towards minorities overall in that era of time. The stuff John Wayne had published in interviews for example would have ruined him today. Hell, LBJ was all in on the Civil Rights and he called African Americans the N-word.

Not really making excuses, but crucifying a guy (Flair/Watts whoever) for not being up to 2017 PC standards is unfair, especially within the context that a thread like this should have been handled.

 

[cobainwasmurdered]

Watts is also a gigantic homophobe up until the modern era and actively preaching horrible shit.

 

[Super Leather]

Watts was defending Lester Maddox, a restaurant owner (and future governor) in Georgia who filed a lawsuit in the mid '60s so he could continue refusing service to black customers - he said that he would rather close his restaurant than be expected to go along with the recently-passed Civil Rights Act. Watts respected Maddox's position saying that he shouldn't have to serve fried chicken to black people if he didn't want to.

I've read Watts' autobiography a bunch and he openly talks about his issues with racism. He's said that he doesn't consider himself racist, but also isn't convinced that he's not 100% not-racist due to his circumstances. I'd describe him as racist by today's standards, but probably not by that of his generation. He's definitely homophobic by any standard and doesn't care much for assertive women either.

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

I've read Watts' autobiography a bunch and he openly talks about his issues with racism. He's said that he doesn't consider himself racist, but also isn't convinced that he's not 100% not-racist due to his circumstances...

Out of curiosity, how many racists have you met in your life, that would actually cop to it? Like, "Yup, I'm racist as fuck!" As opposed to the ones who are like, "There ain't a goddamned racist bone in my body! I just happen to think that niggers are inferior to whites."

 

[BUTT]

"If you want a business and you put money in, why shouldn't you be able to discriminate? It's your business.

If free enterprise is going to make or break it, you should be able to discriminate? It should be that, by God, if you're going to open your doors in America, you can discriminate. Why the fuck not?

That's why I went into business, so that I could discriminate. I mean, really. I mean I want to be able to serve who I want to. It's my business. It's my investment ... I can't tell a fag to get the fuck out. I should have the right to not associate with a fag if I don't want to. I mean, why should I have to hire a fuckin' fag, if I don't like fags? Fags discriminate against us, don't they? Sure they do ... Do blacks discriminate against whites?

Who's killed more blacks than anyone? The fuckin' blacks. But they want to blame that bullshit Roots that came on the air. That Roots was so bullshit. All you have to do if you want slaves is to hand beads to the chiefs and they gave you slaves. What is the best thing that has ever happened to the black race? That they were brought to this country. No matter how they got here. You know why? Because they intermarried and got educated. They're the ones running the black race.

You go down to the black countries and they're all broke. Idi Amin killed more blacks than we ever killed. You see what I mean. That's how stupid we are. But we get all caught up in this bullshit rhetoric, And so, it's ridiculous what's happening to our country.

Lester Maddox was right. If I don't want to sell fried chicken to blacks I shouldn't have to. It's my restaurant. Hell, at least I respect him for his stand."

 

[Shooting Star]

Well, Bill Watts is obviously a piece of shit racist.

 

[Super Leather]

Out of curiosity, how many racists have you met in your life, that would actually cop to it? Like, "Yup, I'm racist as fuck!" As opposed to the ones who are like, "There ain't a goddamned racist bone in my body! I just happen to think that niggers are inferior to whites."

I've had a few run-ins with Nazi skinheads in my life; there's nothing ambiguous about swastika tattoos and yelling "WHITE POWER!" at the top of your lungs.

 

[BruiserBrody]

My co-worker was in Nam, so he hates Asians. And Blacks. And most white people. He uses the n-word and is a hard right wing guy. But he's 71 and I get why he's the way he is.

He is pretty extreme about it though as he has a HAM radio and apparently calls it N____ Free Radio when he's broadcasting. In a awesome turn of events, his daughter married a Hispanic, who he hates too.

I'm friends with him because he likes wrasslin', Bigfoot and has a ton of war stories, so he and I watch a bunch of the same shows.

I think he is the only overt racist I know though. My mother is in her 70's and uses the word "negro", but that was the word that was proper in the 50's, so when I scold her now she doesn't quite grasp why.

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

Out of curiosity, how many racists have you met in your life, that would actually cop to it? Like, "Yup, I'm racist as fuck!" As opposed to the ones who are like, "There ain't a goddamned racist bone in my body! I just happen to think that niggers are inferior to whites."

I've had a few run-ins with Nazi skinheads in my life; there's nothing ambiguous about swastika tattoos and yelling "WHITE POWER!" at the top of your lungs.

No, there isn't, but the question is, do they think they're racist? Like we're talking about Watts who, in his own words, doesn't think of himself as racist but, from my POV, is unequivocally so.

 

[Super Leather]

Out of curiosity, how many racists have you met in your life, that would actually cop to it? Like, "Yup, I'm racist as fuck!" As opposed to the ones who are like, "There ain't a goddamned racist bone in my body! I just happen to think that niggers are inferior to whites."

I've had a few run-ins with Nazi skinheads in my life; there's nothing ambiguous about swastika tattoos and yelling "WHITE POWER!" at the top of your lungs.

No, there isn't, but the question is, do they think they're racist? Like we're talking about Watts who, in his own words, doesn't think of himself as racist but, from my POV, is unequivocally so.

Seriously? Yes, real-deal neo-Nazi skinhead assholes a la Romper Stomper and American History X know that they are racist. Of course they do, they make it abundantly clear. That's who I'm talking about when I answer your question about whether or not I've met admitted racists. We don't get along very well; I guess I'm just too much of a left-wing n-loving liberal punk rock longhaired homosexual whatever-the-fuck for them and that is quite all right with me!

Racism to Watts and white people of his era is simply defined. There's no thought given to things like power structures and skin privilege and whatnot. Being friendly with the black guys on the college football team, seeing how much harder they had to work to get ahead and respecting that (BAH GAWD!), and pushing JYD and Ron Simmons is good enough in his eyes. He's obviously not considered how patronizing and tokenistic he has been in his approach towards people of color though - that's what makes Watts still-a-racist-anyway to me.

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

I wasn't trying to wind you up, I swear. I only asked it in that way because I have had different life experiences: not with neo-Nazis, but I had a guy who was wearing an armband with the Klan insignia on it look me in the eye and tell me that he wasn't racist. I honestly wouldn't have expected any less of a disconnect on the part of a Nazi.

 

[Super Leather]

All good.

 

[Shooting Star]

Maybe Flair wasn't all that sick and his manager exagerated it which is why first thing he did after recovering was fire her?

 

[vivisectvi]

https://www.gerweck.net/2018/12/02/ric-flair-addresses-recent-health-scare-admits-to-needing-detoxing-is-drinking-again/

Ric Flair on how he has still drank alcohol after his recent health scare: “I’m gonna be completely honest with you. I’ve asked the doctor ten different times and of course I’ll ask other doctors because I refuse to believe – at my wedding I had three glasses of champagne. At my daughter’s wedding I had the same or maybe one glass of wine with the champagne and while I was in Florida with Wendy, this past week, we were there for Thanksgiving, I drank about four beers, so it’s not the alcohol that’s gonna hurt me. It’s that the doctors are afraid that if I have one, that will lead to another, but I have had a drink, so alcohol is not gonna kill me. I’ve never had any hard liquor and that won’t happen, but I have had probably ten or twelve beverages with alcohol in them; beer, wine, or champagne.”

Ya, buddy is delusional and should probably familiarize himself with AA if he thinks that his way of thinking actually works.