Oil!

[Dobbs3K]

That's bullshit. It's not a lack of brains, it's a lack of resolve and policymakers who are in the pocket of special interests who want to preserve their ways of doing business.

This is basically it. The majority of the government is too beholden to big oil to force any real change.

 

[ericmm]

Urgh.

 

[Dobbs3K]

Dammit, our government is pretty fucking incompetent.

No, that is not a new realization.

 

[Vampiro69]

We have alot of wind farms popping up in North Dakota. What alot of people are protesting about them here are the following:

1. The light flicker: This would be when the blades are moving causing a light flicker and some people are afraid that they could get a seizure from it.

2. Some people are also saying that they actually make alot of noise. I have been near them and I never heard much noise.

3. Could mess with the flight patterns of migratory birds. I can somewhat see that because we are right in the middle of the central flyway. However I do think that the birds are smart enough to avoid the blades.

4. There still isn't a real great way for saving the generated power that they make.

Those are the arguements that are being presented up in this area against the turbines.

 

[Dobbs3K]

I don't think modern windmills are really that noisy. Any noise they make seems to be very minimal, at least what I've noticed from first hand experience.

 

[Agent of Oblivion]

They're certainly no noisier than a coal plant and the massive rail lines that feed them.

 

[Precious Roy]

(Reuters) - The total bill related to the oil spill drifting toward Louisiana from a well operated by BP Plc in the Gulf of Mexico, could exceed $14 billion, analysts said.

Since an explosion almost two weeks ago on the Deepwater Horizon rig, a disaster scenario has emerged with hundreds of thousands of gallons of crude oil spewing unchecked into the Gulf and moving inexorably northward to the coast. The responsibility for the cleanup operation lies with the owners of the well, led by 65 percent shareholder, London-based oil company BP Plc.

BP said last week that it was spending $6 million a day on the clean up but admitted this figure would rise sharply when the slick hits land.

Neither the company or its 25 percent partner, explorer Anadarko Petroleum, have put an estimate on total costs, although BP CEO Tony Hayward told Reuters in an interview on Friday that he would pay all legitimate claims for damages.

The final bill for cleaning up the spill could be $7 billion, Neil McMahon, analyst at investment firm Bernstein said.

Analysts at Morgan Stanley put the figure at $3.5 billion, while analysts at Citigroup, Evolution Securities and Panmure Gordon put cleanup costs at under $1.1 billion.

Compensation that must be paid to those impacted by the slick could also amount to billions of dollars.

The cost to the fishing industry in Louisiana could be $2.5 billion, while the Florida tourism industry could lose $3 billion, Bernstein predicted.

BP will also have to spend $100 million to drill a relief well to try and stem the flow of the well, while the loss of the Deepwater Horizon well represents a hit of around $1 billion for its owner, Swiss-based drilling specialist Transocean.

COMPENSATION FOR WORKERS

Eleven workers are missing, presumed dead, following the rig explosion and compensation will have to be made to their families.

BP was forced to pay out $2 billion in compensation after 15 workers died in an explosion at its Texas City refinery in 2005, although Peter Hitchens at Panmure said it was likely liabilities related to the rig would be Transocean's responsibility.

BP and its partners in the oil block where the leaking well is located will have to cover the cleanup costs and damages on a basis proportionate to their shareholdings, which will leave BP with 65 percent of the bill.

The company self-insures through its own insurance company, named Jupiter. Contrary to press reports, Jupiter does not lay off risks onto reinsurers or syndicates at Lloyds of London, a spokesman said on Sunday.

Hence, BP will end up paying any costs out of its own pocket.

However, it is possible BP and Anadarko could seek to reclaim any damages from Cameron International Corp, the supplier of the well head equipment which has been blamed for the accident or companies involved in maintaining the drilling machinery.

The oil is leaking because a shut-off valve that should automatically kick in when a problem occurs, has not functioned.

The valve, known as a blow-out preventer, was supplied by Cameron and operated, as an integral part of Transocean's rig.

Oil services provider Halliburton said it performed a variety of work on the rig.

If BP could prove that Halliburton or Cameron did something wrong, they could lay part of the blame on them, Mike Breard, an energy analyst with Hodges Capital Management in Dallas said last week.

Shares in BP have fallen around 13 percent since the accident, wiping out $20 billion of the company's market value.

Shares in Anadarko, Transocean, Cameron and Halliburton have also been hit.

If regulators find any wrongdoing or incompetence on the part of the companies involved, it could levy fines, although analysts said that going by previous fines, these would likely be in the range of tens of millions -- immaterial to the total bill.

In such a situation, the courts could also award punitive damages.

Exxon Mobil was hit with $5 billion in punitive damages after the its tanker Valdez leaked 258,000 barrels of heavy crude into Prince William Sound in Alaska in 1989. The award was based on the fact Exxon had not taken due care when it employed a man with a drinking problem to skipper its tanker.

However, the damages against it were subsequently reduced to around $500 million on appeal.

All analysts agreed that the final bill for the Deepwater Horizon incident will depend on how much damage is caused.

Bernstein said the experience from the first Gulf War in 1991 suggested the damage across Louisiana, Alabama, Mississippi and Florida could be less than many expect because of the warm water in the area.

"The Iraqi army opened valves on the Sea Island terminal, dumping up to 450 million gallons (around 11 million barrels) of crude into the sea in order to obstruct a potential landing by coalition forces," McMahon said in a research note.

"While the magnitude of the spill was vastly greater than the Exxon Valdez, it actually did relatively little long-term damage, as it dispersed in the warm waters," he added.

 

[Urban Warfare]

For more than three weeks now, crude oil has been erupting out of a pipe a mile underneath the surface of the Gulf of Mexico. A new analysis of seafloor video indicates that nearly 70,000 barrels are gushing out every day, NPR reports. That is at least 10 times the U.S. Coast Guard's original estimate of the flow, and "the equivalent of one Exxon Valdez tanker every four days."

Jesus H Christ.

https://preview.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=126809525&sc=nl&cc=brk-20100513-1917

Check out the video of the spill. Absolutely mindblowing.

 

[Agent of Oblivion]

Why don't they blast it shut?

 

[Twisted Intestine]

Shouldn't they have an A B and C emergency shutoff plan in case something like this were to happen? They didn't even really have a plan A?

 

[cobainwasmurdered]

Well they're going to try and clog it with golf balls and shit. Sounds like a plan to me.

 

[Urban Warfare]

Given the extraordinary level of incompetence both before and after the spill, and Obama's flip flop on offshore drilling something isn't right here. Somehow, I get the feeling a couple of assholes are really benefiting from this.

 

[Mattdotcom]

Given the extraordinary level of incompetence both before and after the spill, and Obama's flip flop on offshore drilling something isn't right here. Somehow, I get the feeling a couple of assholes are really benefiting from this.

So I read that Haliburton did a lot of construction on the oil rigs that broke, and one of the main reasons the leak got to be as bad as it did was because Haliburton decided they didn't need to install emegency shut off valves that are commonly used on other sights.

So it's this but with oil instead of fire I guess?

 

[Dobbs3K]

Obama gave some lip service to ending the "cozy relationship" between Washington and the oil companies today. I don't really believe him though.

Really, between the financial companies raping our economy and the oil companies raping our environment, I think some more heavy handed measures are in order.

 

[cobainwasmurdered]

When aren't you in favour of heavy handed measures?

 

[SFH]

Outside my office yesterday we could smell it when the wind shifted. I live in South Central Louisiana so yeah, it's approaching. Some famous hunting and fishing places (Last Island) are already closed due to oil.

 

[Dobbs3K]

When aren't you in favour of heavy handed measures?

Pretty much never. I believe its the government's job to punish people that screw over the American people.

 

[Smartly Pretty]

CWRoberts Presentation 2.wmv

This is remarkable. We should really look into doing this on some large scale.

 

[Precious Roy]

They mentioned something about the viscosity of the oil but I couldn't really understand what they said. Standard motor oil (which it looks like they were using) has a low viscosity at room temperature, whereas crude oil has a very high viscosity. They really aren't comparable.

Were they using salt water or freshwater in their demonstration?

Also, the water in the gulf of Mexico is warm, probably between 75 and 80 degrees this time of year. Was the water heated to that temperature?

It seems like a nice idea, but this demonstration doesn't seem very scientific. Looks like a couple of guys with fields full of hay they want to sell at a premium.

 

[BruiserBrody]

The radio said they are discussing tossing huge amounts of DOG HAIR onto the oil spill to soak it up as well.

 

[CBright7831]

I sure do hope that nobody flicks their cigarette overboard out there.

Actually, on second thought, that would be kind of cool. Go for it!

 

[ericmm]

The developing story, to me, is that most of the oil that has been vented in the more recent timeperiod has been hit with dispersants underwater so that it breaks up and doesn't rise.

BP is trying to prevent the huge visual of the oil slick on top of the ocean, but instead they are leavign all this oil underwater, where it can be just as damaging to the ecosystem, just less bad-press.

They also refuse to discuss how much oil is actually coming out of the pipe. So if you put two and two together, they are trying to base all estimates of amount of crude on the surface area, instead of the pipe emissions, and they're trying to mitigate the surface oil, not actually deal with the subsurface oil.

That, and no one seems to realize that venting this much Methane into the gulf is going to create massive, massive dead zones.

But I guess there are no finger prints deep underwater... :

 

[SFH]

Shrimping has been suspended locally.

 

[Precious Roy]

from E!

If this were a movie, it would be too unbelievable. Since it's real life, well…it's even more unbelievable.

Ready for this one? We may have Kevin Costner to thank for solving the Gulf Coast's oil spill crisis. Of course, Mr. Dances With Wolves isn't working alone. James Cameron and Robert Redford are also lending some much needed (albeit curiously qualified) hands to the cause…

Here's the deal: Earlier this month, Costner unveiled an oil-cleaning device to which he has devoted 15 years and $24 million to a mightily impressed and, let's be honest, somewhat flabbergasted, public. Costner came up with the device, which basically filters oil out of water—novel idea, huh?—while filming Waterworld.

(He purchased the technology, first developed by the Department of Energy after the disastrous Exxon Valdez spill.)

This week, since it has no other ideas, BP OK'd preliminary testing on "the Costner solution." The company and the U.S. Coast Guard will test six of the oil separators next week.

"It's not anymore about talk," Costner said this month while unveiling the project his team of scientists have spent the better part of two decades finessing. "It's about doing the walk, and that phrase was probably invented down here."

And lest you think Costner is just the bizarrely-chosen face of this project, think again.

"Yes, Kevin is a star, but he took his stardom and wrote all the checks for this project out of his own pocket," business partner and Louisiana attorney John Houghtaling told the Los Angeles Times.

Still confused? You're in good company. Well, company.

"It certainly is an odd thing to see a 'Kevin Costner' and a 'centrifugal oil separator' together in a place like the Gulf of Mexico," Stephen Baldwin, who himself is making a documentary about the oil spill, told the paper.

Yeah, almost as odd as seeing a "Stephen Baldwin" and a "documentary about the oil spill" together in one place. His funding alone boggles the mind.

"But, hey, some of the best ideas sometimes come from the strangest places."

HOLLYWOOD TO THE RESCUE! Instead of Sean Penn and Spike Lee it's Kevin Costner and Stephen Baldwin! Louisiana is fucked.

 

[AA484]

Edit: wrong thread

 

[Dobbs3K]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20100523/pl_afp/usoilpollutionenvironmentpalinobama_20100523204803

"Drill baby drill", indeed.

The former vice presidential candidate and Alaska governor, who champions off-shore drilling, criticized the media for not drawing the link between Obama and big oil and said if this spill had happened under former Republican president George W. Bush the scrutiny would have been far tougher.

"I don't know why the question isn't asked by the mainstream media and by others if there's any connection with the contributions made to president Obama and his administration and the support by the oil companies to the administration," she told Fox News Sunday.

More than 3.5 million dollars has been given to candidates by BP over the last 20 years, with the largest single donation, 77,051 dollars, going to Obama, according to the Center for Responsive Politics.

Palin suggested this close relationship explained why Obama was, "taking so doggone long to get in there, to dive in there, and grasp the complexity and the potential tragedy that we are seeing here in the Gulf of Mexico."

 

[909]

Palin is retarded but I don't see what this has to do with our problem. Who gives a fuck? These silly little media games just distract us from the real issues. The Obama administration is nothing short of completely incompetent. A very large part of their campaign was how we needed to shift our focus onto using alternative resources. Where has that gone? I haven't heard it mentioned other than in passing since he gained office. Fuck that. We need to get on some other shit right fucking now, solar, hydrogen, I don't give a fuck. They don't even use this opportunity to grandstand and state the importance of doing so. This leak has been pouring oil into the ocean for a month now. This is our future at stake. We cannot drill anymore. The potential sites for drilling are high risk and pose even higher likelihood of these things occurring.

They bitch and whine about Arizona but don't even try to do anything about immigration. They should've done that shit when they had the opportunity and not let states get the chance to take those kinds of crazy measures. They need to have done immigration reform sometime around LAST YEAR. Obama's administration is every bit as incompetent as Bush's. They suck.

I'm very disappointed. We need better.

 

[snuffbox]

I completely agree. It is the only vote I have made that I regret.

 

[909]

Any liberal who doesn't regret it probably never was a liberal to begin with, or they're flat out insane.

I don't even know how to describe him. If he had a decent term I would've voted for him in 2014 but that'll never happen now. I have never seen a President that does as little as him. If his term was up this year there would be no way anyone could justify voting for him. He would get rolled.

I don't understand it is all. If he had the spine to do things I disliked, I'd still respect him, but he doesn't have the spine to do anything at all. This is worse than Bush's Katrina response.

 

[still fly]

I tend to blame this disaster on years of incremental deregulation of the Oil Industry to the point of criminal negligence, but thats just me. Whether Obama is to be blamed for this is up to one's opinion/political affiliation. Personally, I doubt Obama or the culpable party can really do much at this point in the game.

At this point, I doubt any President of any affiliation can do much to reverse the downward spiral of this country. We have given the corporations and the oligarchs way to much power in the country, and nothing short of an armed revolution will be enough to reclaim power for the regular person.