Youth N Asia
Boners, and farts.
Has anyone played Inindo: Way of the Ninja or Paladin's Quest for the SNES? Two great games that were way WAY under the RPG radar?
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Top 10 RPGs
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Conspiracy_Victim
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Smues said:
I used to play a MMUD called Moral Decay through college and still log on every once in a while, but it's slowly dying. I've tried a couple of more (Realms of the Dragon, etc.) but I don't really have the time to sit down and play a game for hours at a time. That's why I stay away from WoW.
Kageho
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I actually had to sit here and think about this one. Long and hard. Then I envoked a single series rule and this made life easier.
Top 10 RPGs
10. Phantasy Star IV (Genesis) - The best game in the Phantasy Star series, the reason why it makes this list is simply because the cut scenes for its time are amazing. The music is excellent. The futuristic yet not setting is also neat. You travel to four different worlds (or was it FIVE? I forget...). You have Cyborgs, demons, catgirls and many other varied races joining your party other than the typical "human". You also had probably the most hated villian in Zio, simply because he kills off probably the best female lead to come along in a long time, Alis. I don't know about you, but game for its time was great.
Also you got vehicles that attacked shit. How cool is that? I remember just taking out my tank to blow through some baddies simply because I knew the thing could.
9. Tactics Ogre (SNES) - Let's get this out of the way. The reason why I nominated the SNES version over the PSX version is because 1) there's no difference in graphics, 2) there's no difference in gameplay, and 3) the superior translation from the SNES version was not kept for the PSX version. Don't ask me, I don't get that either.
Regardless, Tactics Ogre is the game that gave us many multiple ways to play a game and see a story out in a RPG on a console long before it was cool and all the endings were actually well done and thought out (it wasn't first, and I made sure not to state that), unlike the game that made this popular (its higher up on the list). Tactics Ogre also made each choice you made in the game have major and severe consequences that you would need to pay for later on. When people died, they died unless you could get the rez spell and even then people still likely died. It was an unforgiving and very welcomed experience. Best part is when you beat the game you got to see nearly what everyone was going to do after the adventure was over. Instead of this sad sack of endings we have now. Yes, Tales of Vesperia, I'm looking at you.
8) Tales of Vesperia (Xbox 360) - Speaking of Tales of Vesperia, here we go...
No, I kid, that's not #8. Just because they pulled a fucking Xenogears on us with it. And I haven't played the real version which will be on the PS3. Also, before I continue, no Xenogears didn't make this list either. And for that reason as well.
8. Valkyrie Chronicles (PS3) - I bet you thought it was going to be all old generation game didn't you? Valkyrie Chronicles is a massively beautiful game. The art style is awesome as its like watching a painting in motion. The story is actually quite good for a tactical game, characters were very well done, and the game play kept you coming back for more. At first I was a little leary of the gameplay thinking that there was no way that this would and should become the new standard of tactical rpgs for fighting. Sadly, it doesn't seem to have catched on. The biggest downside of this game is some classes are practically useless outside of their intended function (lancer ho~!).
7. Tales of Symphona (GC) - This game is old school personified. Many characters were cliches, the storyline you've seen before in a way, the music was lifted from a lot of the previous Tales of games (specifically Tales of Phantasia), but you know what? This is the game people should look at if they want to make an old school RPG in the new generation world of graphics and stuff. You played because you wanted to get to know the characters better because you came to like them, you wanted to progress to the next story line point because the story while being something you've seen before was handled so well that you're just like "fits like a glove". The music while being borrowed from earlier in the series was taken, expanded upon, and remastered into their own little gems.
That's the only reason I've got it stuck on 7 and not higher. Is the fact that its so full of what RPGs are that you can't move it higher.
6. Suikoden (PSX) - Its already been said why this game is on people's lists, but I think people need to be reminded of something. The awesome weapon called Soul Eater Rune, is in fact going to 1) kill you eventually, 2) probably corrupt you at some point before you die and make you go evil, and 3) consume your soul. Another thing that I think people don't realize is that this is possibly the first game that hybrids two different genres into one and does them successfuly. While there are strategy RPGs, this you could almost say was two entire games since the strategy elements had no bearings on what you did with your levels in the RPG elements. So you could actually leave people alone and not use them if you didn't find uses for them.
And frankly considering the amount of characters that are playable, quite a lot of them actually had good back stories and you actually got attatched to your army of stars. My old user name, Lightning Flik is based off of the character of the same name. Though the reason why I took it as my own wasn't until #2 came along...
Another thing is that you could blast through the game super quick, but if you actually spent the time, collect all 108 stars, you manage to save your friend whom died protecting you. He's also probably the first homosexual character in the video game history that was a lead character. Yes, I do realize that in that time period people who were saved from poverty and allowed a normal life would actually behave like that. Still, looking back...
5. Secret of Mana (SNES) - Kicking sound track, some pretty awesome characters, Flammie, many different weapons, special attacks, Flammie, 3 people can play at the same time, boss battles that depended a lot on timing and knowing their weakness, Flammie, most remembered opening theme in the history of gaming (sure you can't actually recall the name, but once you hear it, you know what it is), no damn overworld that you trecked just one place to the next (unless flying), also Flamm-aw fucking hell, he's the WHAT?
4. Earthbound (a.k.a. Mother SNES) - How does this get skipped over by so many people? Earthbound was a blast, funny, sad, and crazy. I mean when the game starts off with a fly coming back in time to aid you, you just know the game is either going to be a) one awesome game or b) this will suck hard and bad (see: Thousand Arms). And best of all? Praying. Its your best weapon, don't forget it.
3. Chrono Trigger (SNES) - This game has time travel, it makes sense, has one of the most memorable sound tracks in the history of gaming, multiple endings, fantastic characters, a very well develop story that didn't make our brains hurt (it has time travel, it better), a silent protagonist who you understand better than any character who's ever had lines in an RPG... Do I need to go on? And yes, this game only made 3rd on my list.
2. Final Fantasy VII (PSX) - As much as I like to bash this game, let's get something straight. When it originally came out, you couldn't really point at all of its flaws like you can now and go "man... how did we buy that?". The game was full of cool at the time and we drank it down to aid us in quenching our RPG thirst. Music was a blast (as long as it was in the game), storyline never got dull but until the end (when RPGs usually get dull and I really wonder if that's just more because you've gotta fucking grind... now I'm trailing off in a bracket, my bad), you had many different mini-games and side quests you could do. It was a real sand box RPG before such a thing was a nearly real thing. And at the time, the characters were probably the most original that you've seen in a while. Not saying depth wise, because there's no way I can defend some of these characters depth...
Let's go through our list of characters so everyone gets my point:
Cloud - First time we've ever had a bad ass for a lead character. He knows he's good, he knows he can kick your ass, and he does it while waving around a sword that there's no way in God's name can he swing without some magical strength. And hey, if you look back, he's the very first character that's actually gone through hell and back as a lead. Like usually for a character with a past like his, you get a character in the party who might have a past like that, a villian who you exterminate in the middle of the story and feel pity for (or near the end depending on his relevence to the story), or the sympathic end boss.
No, we get this guy as the lead. And at the time, it was cool.
Tifa - Sweet child hood friend... Yeah, sure she is. She also knows the entire truth about Cloud's past (most sorry), doesn't ever come clean about it, wants to with him for the rest of her life and basically plays the psycho must have him girlfriend gimmick to do that. Honestly, looking back, I wonder why I didn't ever think "ok, when is she gonna snap?". Also, you kinda feel for her as she totally gets screwed out of ever getting it on with Cloud because he's always going to be pining the girl he couldn't have.
...this was before the movie, the side games, and all that other junk. I'm not including Crisis Core in that mess, because I haven't played it actually.
Barrett - Sure, he plays the stereotype up to a T... Heh, heh... Get it? ...yeah, lame, I know, bite me. But does he really? He has a daughter that he worships the ground on and does everything for, he makes sure to keep the kids in check of the party, and also he's probably the only guy in the party who uses his head the most. How swell is that? An "old man" of the party that actually does his f'n job of doing what the ol' guy should do.
Aeris - Young and innocent girl whom you practically are all over... Wait... She thinks Cloud looks cute in a dress, say what? Another bait and switch. While she's the last of her kind, her former lover hasn't returned and possibly dead, the Turks are hunting her down, etc... She's got everything against her, but she never once gets down about it. She always thinks positively, she always keeps moving forward, and never stopped. This was refreshing for a character that as soon as you start pegged "oh yeah, totally taking over as Cloud's main interest and so going to be annoyingly sweet". And honestly when she died, you can't tell me you weren't sad because the whole funeral was just heart wrenching. ... if you don't know that she died already, and say "whoa you bitch, its a spoiler" hand in your RPG Club Card(tm) and get out, ok?
Nanaki (Red XIII) - Supposed to be either the cute and cuddly or the ferocious beast, he turns out to be neither and instead is the smartest person on the roster (in terms of intelligence). And that's usually the type of character his type is. ...cute and cuddly or ferocious beast that is.
Cait Sith - This character is probably the least well used simply because... Well the actual thing is a robot. Say what? You mean it isn't going to turn out like to be some God of Evil or something rediculous like that? Damn. And its actually a better party member than the guy controlling the robot. ...wait, think about that for a second? The guy controlling the robot is better at being an actual party member as the robot than as himself! Need I say more?
Yuffie - She's a Ninja who steals things! But wait! It actually turns out that she's really Robin Hood and she's doing all of this to save her village. Though she needs to turn down the greed factor.
Vincent - ...I was going to do a write up for Vincent, but you know what? I can't. It would take too long and frankly all I need to do is point out that he has the most depth of the entire roster and he's a character you don't even need to acquire adds all I need tos ay.
Cid - Sure he's a cranky bastard that you'd likely want to hit with a pipe wrench just because of the level of it, but you eventually find out that he just uses that as a defense mechanism to push people away and he really is more like a child in terms of doing what he wants to make himself happy.
Back then when you were given a character, you practically could go "oh, I see where this is going." With these guys, it was new, fresh, hip. Though, nowadays they are shells of what they were and they now too have become cliches.
That's the only reason why I put this at #2. Is because I went back and remembered the relevence this had on me and RPGs.
1. Persona 4 (PS2) - I don't think anyone should be surprised about this, since I didn't mention this anywhere previously. Sure it doesn't have the "wow" that Final Fantasy VII did, but it did something that Final Fantasy VII didn't do. As a sequel it actually nails nearly every and all aspects that made the previous game in the series good, upgrade it and then make it even better. The soundtrack is fantastic, the characters are awesome, so many things to do that you will never get them all done at the same time without the help of a guide ... yes, it is POSSBILE, but don't try it till after you beat the game the first time.
Also, the choices you make do effect the world around you and the people you are with. Which brings in the aspects of Tactics Ogre that people loved (ok, I loved it most, shut up), it gave people that feeling that a lot of RPGs don't seem to do these days. And that is make you feel like you actually are playing a role and being someone. Not just being taken for a ride. I think that's the best thing about Persona 4 and that's why I put it above Final Fantasy VII.
And if you must know why I did not toss Zelda on here, I can't. It wasn't an RPG till everyone and their mother decided "oh, hey, you might as well include it since it has RPG-like elements".
And Inindo I don't think I ever played. Might be something I go hunting for on ROMs and see what its about. As for Paladin's Quest, I think the major reason why is simply because a) it was forgetable when it came out, b) I don't recall a single character in it that I could attatch myself too, and c) the end boss is a fucking bitch if you totally don't level up all you spells so you get the ultimate spell to save your ass. If I did a Top 30 though (single series rule) it would probably make that list.
Top 10 RPGs
10. Phantasy Star IV (Genesis) - The best game in the Phantasy Star series, the reason why it makes this list is simply because the cut scenes for its time are amazing. The music is excellent. The futuristic yet not setting is also neat. You travel to four different worlds (or was it FIVE? I forget...). You have Cyborgs, demons, catgirls and many other varied races joining your party other than the typical "human". You also had probably the most hated villian in Zio, simply because he kills off probably the best female lead to come along in a long time, Alis. I don't know about you, but game for its time was great.
Also you got vehicles that attacked shit. How cool is that? I remember just taking out my tank to blow through some baddies simply because I knew the thing could.
9. Tactics Ogre (SNES) - Let's get this out of the way. The reason why I nominated the SNES version over the PSX version is because 1) there's no difference in graphics, 2) there's no difference in gameplay, and 3) the superior translation from the SNES version was not kept for the PSX version. Don't ask me, I don't get that either.
Regardless, Tactics Ogre is the game that gave us many multiple ways to play a game and see a story out in a RPG on a console long before it was cool and all the endings were actually well done and thought out (it wasn't first, and I made sure not to state that), unlike the game that made this popular (its higher up on the list). Tactics Ogre also made each choice you made in the game have major and severe consequences that you would need to pay for later on. When people died, they died unless you could get the rez spell and even then people still likely died. It was an unforgiving and very welcomed experience. Best part is when you beat the game you got to see nearly what everyone was going to do after the adventure was over. Instead of this sad sack of endings we have now. Yes, Tales of Vesperia, I'm looking at you.
8) Tales of Vesperia (Xbox 360) - Speaking of Tales of Vesperia, here we go...
No, I kid, that's not #8. Just because they pulled a fucking Xenogears on us with it. And I haven't played the real version which will be on the PS3. Also, before I continue, no Xenogears didn't make this list either. And for that reason as well.
8. Valkyrie Chronicles (PS3) - I bet you thought it was going to be all old generation game didn't you? Valkyrie Chronicles is a massively beautiful game. The art style is awesome as its like watching a painting in motion. The story is actually quite good for a tactical game, characters were very well done, and the game play kept you coming back for more. At first I was a little leary of the gameplay thinking that there was no way that this would and should become the new standard of tactical rpgs for fighting. Sadly, it doesn't seem to have catched on. The biggest downside of this game is some classes are practically useless outside of their intended function (lancer ho~!).
7. Tales of Symphona (GC) - This game is old school personified. Many characters were cliches, the storyline you've seen before in a way, the music was lifted from a lot of the previous Tales of games (specifically Tales of Phantasia), but you know what? This is the game people should look at if they want to make an old school RPG in the new generation world of graphics and stuff. You played because you wanted to get to know the characters better because you came to like them, you wanted to progress to the next story line point because the story while being something you've seen before was handled so well that you're just like "fits like a glove". The music while being borrowed from earlier in the series was taken, expanded upon, and remastered into their own little gems.
That's the only reason I've got it stuck on 7 and not higher. Is the fact that its so full of what RPGs are that you can't move it higher.
6. Suikoden (PSX) - Its already been said why this game is on people's lists, but I think people need to be reminded of something. The awesome weapon called Soul Eater Rune, is in fact going to 1) kill you eventually, 2) probably corrupt you at some point before you die and make you go evil, and 3) consume your soul. Another thing that I think people don't realize is that this is possibly the first game that hybrids two different genres into one and does them successfuly. While there are strategy RPGs, this you could almost say was two entire games since the strategy elements had no bearings on what you did with your levels in the RPG elements. So you could actually leave people alone and not use them if you didn't find uses for them.
And frankly considering the amount of characters that are playable, quite a lot of them actually had good back stories and you actually got attatched to your army of stars. My old user name, Lightning Flik is based off of the character of the same name. Though the reason why I took it as my own wasn't until #2 came along...
Another thing is that you could blast through the game super quick, but if you actually spent the time, collect all 108 stars, you manage to save your friend whom died protecting you. He's also probably the first homosexual character in the video game history that was a lead character. Yes, I do realize that in that time period people who were saved from poverty and allowed a normal life would actually behave like that. Still, looking back...
5. Secret of Mana (SNES) - Kicking sound track, some pretty awesome characters, Flammie, many different weapons, special attacks, Flammie, 3 people can play at the same time, boss battles that depended a lot on timing and knowing their weakness, Flammie, most remembered opening theme in the history of gaming (sure you can't actually recall the name, but once you hear it, you know what it is), no damn overworld that you trecked just one place to the next (unless flying), also Flamm-aw fucking hell, he's the WHAT?
4. Earthbound (a.k.a. Mother SNES) - How does this get skipped over by so many people? Earthbound was a blast, funny, sad, and crazy. I mean when the game starts off with a fly coming back in time to aid you, you just know the game is either going to be a) one awesome game or b) this will suck hard and bad (see: Thousand Arms). And best of all? Praying. Its your best weapon, don't forget it.
3. Chrono Trigger (SNES) - This game has time travel, it makes sense, has one of the most memorable sound tracks in the history of gaming, multiple endings, fantastic characters, a very well develop story that didn't make our brains hurt (it has time travel, it better), a silent protagonist who you understand better than any character who's ever had lines in an RPG... Do I need to go on? And yes, this game only made 3rd on my list.
2. Final Fantasy VII (PSX) - As much as I like to bash this game, let's get something straight. When it originally came out, you couldn't really point at all of its flaws like you can now and go "man... how did we buy that?". The game was full of cool at the time and we drank it down to aid us in quenching our RPG thirst. Music was a blast (as long as it was in the game), storyline never got dull but until the end (when RPGs usually get dull and I really wonder if that's just more because you've gotta fucking grind... now I'm trailing off in a bracket, my bad), you had many different mini-games and side quests you could do. It was a real sand box RPG before such a thing was a nearly real thing. And at the time, the characters were probably the most original that you've seen in a while. Not saying depth wise, because there's no way I can defend some of these characters depth...
Let's go through our list of characters so everyone gets my point:
Cloud - First time we've ever had a bad ass for a lead character. He knows he's good, he knows he can kick your ass, and he does it while waving around a sword that there's no way in God's name can he swing without some magical strength. And hey, if you look back, he's the very first character that's actually gone through hell and back as a lead. Like usually for a character with a past like his, you get a character in the party who might have a past like that, a villian who you exterminate in the middle of the story and feel pity for (or near the end depending on his relevence to the story), or the sympathic end boss.
No, we get this guy as the lead. And at the time, it was cool.
Tifa - Sweet child hood friend... Yeah, sure she is. She also knows the entire truth about Cloud's past (most sorry), doesn't ever come clean about it, wants to with him for the rest of her life and basically plays the psycho must have him girlfriend gimmick to do that. Honestly, looking back, I wonder why I didn't ever think "ok, when is she gonna snap?". Also, you kinda feel for her as she totally gets screwed out of ever getting it on with Cloud because he's always going to be pining the girl he couldn't have.
...this was before the movie, the side games, and all that other junk. I'm not including Crisis Core in that mess, because I haven't played it actually.
Barrett - Sure, he plays the stereotype up to a T... Heh, heh... Get it? ...yeah, lame, I know, bite me. But does he really? He has a daughter that he worships the ground on and does everything for, he makes sure to keep the kids in check of the party, and also he's probably the only guy in the party who uses his head the most. How swell is that? An "old man" of the party that actually does his f'n job of doing what the ol' guy should do.
Aeris - Young and innocent girl whom you practically are all over... Wait... She thinks Cloud looks cute in a dress, say what? Another bait and switch. While she's the last of her kind, her former lover hasn't returned and possibly dead, the Turks are hunting her down, etc... She's got everything against her, but she never once gets down about it. She always thinks positively, she always keeps moving forward, and never stopped. This was refreshing for a character that as soon as you start pegged "oh yeah, totally taking over as Cloud's main interest and so going to be annoyingly sweet". And honestly when she died, you can't tell me you weren't sad because the whole funeral was just heart wrenching. ... if you don't know that she died already, and say "whoa you bitch, its a spoiler" hand in your RPG Club Card(tm) and get out, ok?
Nanaki (Red XIII) - Supposed to be either the cute and cuddly or the ferocious beast, he turns out to be neither and instead is the smartest person on the roster (in terms of intelligence). And that's usually the type of character his type is. ...cute and cuddly or ferocious beast that is.
Cait Sith - This character is probably the least well used simply because... Well the actual thing is a robot. Say what? You mean it isn't going to turn out like to be some God of Evil or something rediculous like that? Damn. And its actually a better party member than the guy controlling the robot. ...wait, think about that for a second? The guy controlling the robot is better at being an actual party member as the robot than as himself! Need I say more?
Yuffie - She's a Ninja who steals things! But wait! It actually turns out that she's really Robin Hood and she's doing all of this to save her village. Though she needs to turn down the greed factor.
Vincent - ...I was going to do a write up for Vincent, but you know what? I can't. It would take too long and frankly all I need to do is point out that he has the most depth of the entire roster and he's a character you don't even need to acquire adds all I need tos ay.
Cid - Sure he's a cranky bastard that you'd likely want to hit with a pipe wrench just because of the level of it, but you eventually find out that he just uses that as a defense mechanism to push people away and he really is more like a child in terms of doing what he wants to make himself happy.
Back then when you were given a character, you practically could go "oh, I see where this is going." With these guys, it was new, fresh, hip. Though, nowadays they are shells of what they were and they now too have become cliches.
That's the only reason why I put this at #2. Is because I went back and remembered the relevence this had on me and RPGs.
1. Persona 4 (PS2) - I don't think anyone should be surprised about this, since I didn't mention this anywhere previously. Sure it doesn't have the "wow" that Final Fantasy VII did, but it did something that Final Fantasy VII didn't do. As a sequel it actually nails nearly every and all aspects that made the previous game in the series good, upgrade it and then make it even better. The soundtrack is fantastic, the characters are awesome, so many things to do that you will never get them all done at the same time without the help of a guide ... yes, it is POSSBILE, but don't try it till after you beat the game the first time.
Also, the choices you make do effect the world around you and the people you are with. Which brings in the aspects of Tactics Ogre that people loved (ok, I loved it most, shut up), it gave people that feeling that a lot of RPGs don't seem to do these days. And that is make you feel like you actually are playing a role and being someone. Not just being taken for a ride. I think that's the best thing about Persona 4 and that's why I put it above Final Fantasy VII.
And if you must know why I did not toss Zelda on here, I can't. It wasn't an RPG till everyone and their mother decided "oh, hey, you might as well include it since it has RPG-like elements".
And Inindo I don't think I ever played. Might be something I go hunting for on ROMs and see what its about. As for Paladin's Quest, I think the major reason why is simply because a) it was forgetable when it came out, b) I don't recall a single character in it that I could attatch myself too, and c) the end boss is a fucking bitch if you totally don't level up all you spells so you get the ultimate spell to save your ass. If I did a Top 30 though (single series rule) it would probably make that list.
Rendclaw
Integral Poster
Good write-up, Flik. Very well done.
That was one of the best things about FFVII. All of the characters were flawed, and human. Hell you could even fix things so that Cloud could have a romance with Tifa, Aeris, Yuffie, even fucking Barrett (!!!). That is something very few RPGs can, would, or have done before or since. Its touches like that that make an RPG worthwhile, replayable, and fun, no matter how many times you play through it.
That was one of the best things about FFVII. All of the characters were flawed, and human. Hell you could even fix things so that Cloud could have a romance with Tifa, Aeris, Yuffie, even fucking Barrett (!!!). That is something very few RPGs can, would, or have done before or since. Its touches like that that make an RPG worthwhile, replayable, and fun, no matter how many times you play through it.
KOAB
KOAB
I never thought anything was gonna take Suikoden II's top spot for me, then Shadow Hearts came along... and now a game has finally taken that's top spot now that I've completed everything on the game.
1. Persona 4
2. Shadow Hearts
3. Suikoden II
4. Chrono Trigger
5. SaGa Frontier
6. Some Growlanser shit
7. Final Fantasy IX
8. Final Fantasy X
9. Final Fantasy VII
10. Front Mission 3
1. Persona 4
2. Shadow Hearts
3. Suikoden II
4. Chrono Trigger
5. SaGa Frontier
6. Some Growlanser shit
7. Final Fantasy IX
8. Final Fantasy X
9. Final Fantasy VII
10. Front Mission 3
Star Ocean 2
Star Ocean 2
And just for the sake of it, I decided to rank my favorites in each series. Really, compared to the 16-bit era, the PS/early PS2 generation produced the best RPGs. Everything just came together so well. Not just graphically, but gameplay and story-telling wise there was just better production. Anyway, I'm looking at at least 3 games to make a series here, with one exception. I'll include spinoffs and the like, too.
Final Fantasy
1. FF10
2. FFTactics
3. FF6
4. FF9
5. FFTactics 2
6. FF5
7. FF8
8. FF7
9. FF4
10. FF1
Star Ocean
1. SO2
2. SO3
3. SO1
4. Blue Sphere
Tales of
1. Eternia
2. Destiny
3. Narikiri Dungeon 3
4. Narikiri Dungeon 2
5. Destiny 2
6. Symphonia
7. Phantasia
Wild ARMs
1. WA3
2. WA2
3. WA1
4. WA4
Breath of Fire
1. BoF5
2. BoF4
3. BoF3
4. BoF1
Dragon Quest
1. DQ7
2. DQ1
3. DQ8
4. DQ3
5. DQ2
Grandia
1. G2
2. G1
3. GXxxxtreme
4. G3
Arc the Lad
1. Arc 2
2. Arc: Twilight
3. Arc 3
4. Arc 1 (though it's really just a prologue to 2)
Nippon Ichi games
1. Disgaea
2. Phantom Brave
3. Makai Kingdom
4. Disgaea 2
SaGa
1. S Frontier 1
2. S Frontier 2
3. Unlimited
4. Those ones for Game Boy
5. Romancing SaGa (PS2)
Xenogears.
1. Xenogears.
Yeah, I may get ridiculed for that FF list, but it's just based on how much fun I remember I had playing them. 7's fine, but a little too gloomy for me, and 4 was ridiculous with everybody dying and coming back an hour later.
Final Fantasy
1. FF10
2. FFTactics
3. FF6
4. FF9
5. FFTactics 2
6. FF5
7. FF8
8. FF7
9. FF4
10. FF1
Star Ocean
1. SO2
2. SO3
3. SO1
4. Blue Sphere
Tales of
1. Eternia
2. Destiny
3. Narikiri Dungeon 3
4. Narikiri Dungeon 2
5. Destiny 2
6. Symphonia
7. Phantasia
Wild ARMs
1. WA3
2. WA2
3. WA1
4. WA4
Breath of Fire
1. BoF5
2. BoF4
3. BoF3
4. BoF1
Dragon Quest
1. DQ7
2. DQ1
3. DQ8
4. DQ3
5. DQ2
Grandia
1. G2
2. G1
3. GXxxxtreme
4. G3
Arc the Lad
1. Arc 2
2. Arc: Twilight
3. Arc 3
4. Arc 1 (though it's really just a prologue to 2)
Nippon Ichi games
1. Disgaea
2. Phantom Brave
3. Makai Kingdom
4. Disgaea 2
SaGa
1. S Frontier 1
2. S Frontier 2
3. Unlimited
4. Those ones for Game Boy
5. Romancing SaGa (PS2)
Xenogears.
1. Xenogears.
Yeah, I may get ridiculed for that FF list, but it's just based on how much fun I remember I had playing them. 7's fine, but a little too gloomy for me, and 4 was ridiculous with everybody dying and coming back an hour later.
Psycho Penguin
Integral Poster
This is my favorite topic on this entire forum right now. RPGs rule!
Right now, I am hooked on a series called Atelier Iris. I beat Mana Khemia (which is a 'spiritual successor' to the trilogy) and now am addicted to Atelier Iris 3. The PS2 is better than the SNES when it comes to RPGs, no fucking joke.
Oh, and Black Sigil for DS is pretty solid for all you guys craving an old school RPG.
Also, KOAB - Have you played Shadow Hearts Covenant? Although it does not retain the original's doom and gloom atmosphere, it's an incredible game and actually my favorite game of all time. Plus, it really resolved the Yuri/Alice storyline. Just avoid the 3rd Shadow Hearts.
Right now, I am hooked on a series called Atelier Iris. I beat Mana Khemia (which is a 'spiritual successor' to the trilogy) and now am addicted to Atelier Iris 3. The PS2 is better than the SNES when it comes to RPGs, no fucking joke.
Oh, and Black Sigil for DS is pretty solid for all you guys craving an old school RPG.
Also, KOAB - Have you played Shadow Hearts Covenant? Although it does not retain the original's doom and gloom atmosphere, it's an incredible game and actually my favorite game of all time. Plus, it really resolved the Yuri/Alice storyline. Just avoid the 3rd Shadow Hearts.
Conspiracy_Victim
Integral Poster
With all the love for Persona 4, I'm thinking I have to turn my PS2 back on and finish up 3 and move on to 4. I started 4 but I got frustrated over the near impossible difficulty when it came to sneaking up on the monsters. I'll go back and, since it's been a number of months, I'll just start over and get a fresh start.
Psycho Penguin said:
You may want to get a bit further before recommending it. I was looking forward to it too, as a fan of Chrono Trigger. Sadly, it looks like it fell apart due to the amateurs working on it.
1up's Jeremy Parish couldn't really 'review' the final game, since it was so broken he couldn't tolerate finishing it.
Also, while I was kind of hard pressed to think of a console RPG I played/liked in a while, I'd like to think a bit outside the box and mention Steambot Chronicles on PS2. It's sort of less an RPG than a sandbox game, but it's plot heavy and JRPG-enough to mention. It has its fair share of shortcomings (graphics, music-wise, voice acting), but basically its kind of like a Miyazaki-ish steampunk GTA. You man a robot that you can fight in arena battles in, and you can take more legitimate jobs to earn money and upgrade it (although there's a villain path, too). The controls take a bit getting used to (you control it like a Katamari, basically), but it's a nice, easy-going experience that I found one of the most refreshing titles I played in years. Plus, you can get an afro and dress like a pimp!
Trailer: warning--really cheesy music
Steambot Chronicles Trailer
Longer, shows off more gameplay and features:
Bumpy Trot Commercial 3 min A
There's a spinoff (Steambot Chronicles Battle Tournament) that came out on PSP last week, and I picked it up, but it's just not as good and loses a lot of the best parts of the original.
Psycho Penguin
Integral Poster
Well now we're starting to accept that old school RPGs were terribly flawed for the most part too, right?
Star Ocean 2
Star Ocean 2
I meant FFTAdvance 1.
Symphonia's seems pretty overrated. It was decent enough, but kinda recycled stuff from Phantasia and Eternia. And I had Phantasia last, but I've only played the GBA version of it. It's pretty slow; not a good port. The Narikiri Dungeon games, however, are also for GBA, but do the battle system right. Everything is fluid, and you get to play as ALL of the characters from the first 3-5 games. I thought they would be just short throwaways, but they're surprisingly deep. They're worth tracking down.
Symphonia's seems pretty overrated. It was decent enough, but kinda recycled stuff from Phantasia and Eternia. And I had Phantasia last, but I've only played the GBA version of it. It's pretty slow; not a good port. The Narikiri Dungeon games, however, are also for GBA, but do the battle system right. Everything is fluid, and you get to play as ALL of the characters from the first 3-5 games. I thought they would be just short throwaways, but they're surprisingly deep. They're worth tracking down.
Psycho Penguin
Integral Poster
Star Ocean 2 said:
I'm playing through Phantasia now and it's really not as good as I remembered. I am curious as to how you think Symphonia recycled stuff from it - besides the fact it takes place in the same world so theoretically it should be borrowing stuff to make sense.
Psycho Penguin said:
What are you talking about?
If you mean Black Sigil, that's not even the issue (Parish loves Etrian 1&2--hell, he pushed it more than any reviewer I know of). It's just not a professionally-made game and is extremely unpolished.
Black Lushus
Integral Poster
I sorta liked the .hack series on the PS2...never finished the last disc though...
Kageho
@DSookochoff
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It's Quotitis Time!
I think with every MMO coming out and being different types, that's why I didn't include them. Its pretty much its own little genre now. And even then, no MMO has wow'd me enough to include them on a TOP TEN list.
If this was a Top 30 list? Sure, I would probably put one on there. The problem with MMOs, is it takes at least 2-3 years before you really see where its at and how well the actually game is because by then, they've "fixed" everything.
Hey, just wait till you get to 3s ending again! You'll really wish you didn't... I certainly didn't.
PS4 actually was probalby one of the games I would honestly like someone to re-do. Simply because Alis was a lot more likable than Aeris. Though, seriously, the game needs to be expanded on because it certainly is short.
Though, Alis wasn't the first female lead chick killed. That goes to you know who from PS2.
The problem is, that's not what the non-niche want. They want the fancy graphics, the orgasmic music, and the emo characters leading the way. And don't tell me they don't. Otherwise, Gust and Nippon Ichi games would be selling a hell of a lot more than they do. Disgaea excluded.
To be honest, I think to this day that's the only reason why I go back and play SO2. Well that and the amount of little sidequests and character interactions you could do.
Actually, I would say Tales of Symphonia's or Valkyrie Chronicles are just as good systems and aren't gimmicky at all.
Atelier Iris can be considered a spin off of the Atelier series, in which the whole game was just being an alchemist. That's it. You don't try to save the world. You just do alchemic stuff and do more till the game decides to end. Atelier Rorona was the latest one released.
Also the PS2 I don't think has an RPG you could call "bad". Sure you might not like it, but there were many RPGs that had good qualities in them that you could at least like them for.
Near the beginning don't even bother trying to get the sneaking up. Just bash them straight on to start with. It'll take awhile till you can.
The thing about old school RPGs is they can still be successful in this day and age, as long as you do it right. The problem is most people who think "oh yeah, I can make this old school" don't really realize how hard it is to make it old school while not making it "oh hey, I did this in SO2".
Both Tales of Symphonia games take place hundreds of years prior to Tales of Phantasia. Its why most of ust like it. As for Tales of Phantasia, quite a few of you might wanna play the hack ROM we got that Namco swears was wrong. I had a lot more fun playing that then the GBA version. Though, and I know people are going to be looking at me funny, I like Phantasia less than Destiny.
ericmm said:
I think with every MMO coming out and being different types, that's why I didn't include them. Its pretty much its own little genre now. And even then, no MMO has wow'd me enough to include them on a TOP TEN list.
If this was a Top 30 list? Sure, I would probably put one on there. The problem with MMOs, is it takes at least 2-3 years before you really see where its at and how well the actually game is because by then, they've "fixed" everything.
Zorin Industries said:
Hey, just wait till you get to 3s ending again! You'll really wish you didn't... I certainly didn't.
PS4 actually was probalby one of the games I would honestly like someone to re-do. Simply because Alis was a lot more likable than Aeris. Though, seriously, the game needs to be expanded on because it certainly is short.
Though, Alis wasn't the first female lead chick killed. That goes to you know who from PS2.
Youth N Asia said:
The problem is, that's not what the non-niche want. They want the fancy graphics, the orgasmic music, and the emo characters leading the way. And don't tell me they don't. Otherwise, Gust and Nippon Ichi games would be selling a hell of a lot more than they do. Disgaea excluded.
To be honest, I think to this day that's the only reason why I go back and play SO2. Well that and the amount of little sidequests and character interactions you could do.
Rendclaw said:
Actually, I would say Tales of Symphonia's or Valkyrie Chronicles are just as good systems and aren't gimmicky at all.
Psycho Penguin said:
Atelier Iris can be considered a spin off of the Atelier series, in which the whole game was just being an alchemist. That's it. You don't try to save the world. You just do alchemic stuff and do more till the game decides to end. Atelier Rorona was the latest one released.
Also the PS2 I don't think has an RPG you could call "bad". Sure you might not like it, but there were many RPGs that had good qualities in them that you could at least like them for.
Conspiracy_Victim said:
Near the beginning don't even bother trying to get the sneaking up. Just bash them straight on to start with. It'll take awhile till you can.
Psycho Penguin said:
The thing about old school RPGs is they can still be successful in this day and age, as long as you do it right. The problem is most people who think "oh yeah, I can make this old school" don't really realize how hard it is to make it old school while not making it "oh hey, I did this in SO2".
Psycho Penguin said:
Both Tales of Symphonia games take place hundreds of years prior to Tales of Phantasia. Its why most of ust like it. As for Tales of Phantasia, quite a few of you might wanna play the hack ROM we got that Namco swears was wrong. I had a lot more fun playing that then the GBA version. Though, and I know people are going to be looking at me funny, I like Phantasia less than Destiny.
Kageho said:
If you're implying that the niche have better taste (which I don't think you are, though), not really. Gust seems to be for the otaku set that own shelves of rapetastic loli statuettes. Their games often seem to be playable advertisements for their merchandise. Open some of their cases and stuff hawking their merchandise comes shooting out of the casing like a snake nut can. From what I've seen, their stuff repulses me, although it doesn't help that NIS' localizations by and large suck. Also, make no mistake--Disgaea 1 was localized by Atlus.
(standard issue Nippon Ichi troll)As for the games NIS themselves developed, it'll be awesome when they actually get around to making a new one!(/standard issue Nippon Ichi troll)
Psycho Penguin
Integral Poster
1. The other Atelier games didn't come out in America, otherwise I'd be all over them. Alchemy kicks ass!
2. I could definitely call Xenosaga 2 and Shadow Hearts 3 'bad' and Tales of Legendia was some kind of letdown, too. Plus there's all those old obscure RPGs. Ephermal Fantasia? Summonser? Orphen? Eternal Ring?
3. I think people forget to realize that for every FF6 and Chrono Trigger there were Secret of the Stars and 7th Sagas. Just like now when there's Lost Odysseys and Tales of Vesperias amongst the crap. Ten years from now, we'll be longing for the days of Tales of Vesperia and Eternal Sonata.
4. The ROM doesn't fix the fact that the battle system is so slow and magic is worthless. Plus, I can't think of anyone that actually likes Phantasia more than Destiny. Destiny is the same game done better. Same style battles, same style world map.. just a much cleaner and faster battle system.
Rendclaw
Integral Poster
Oh god, 7th Saga... that was an extremely frustrating game.
I have been debating on picking up a used copy of Shadow Hearts for a long time, but I hesitate when I see the busty red-haired character on the front, because I have a personal theory that if the cover art comes down to a "rapetastic" (as Andrew put it) female on the front and not much else, I tend to be wary of it.
On an aside, I would love to see another martial arts based RPG. If I was good at making RPGs with like RPG Maker 3 or the rpg maker for PCs, I would go that route.
This is what I mean about making an old-school, low-cost gaming company. Take the classics and retool them to bring them into the modern day.
I have been debating on picking up a used copy of Shadow Hearts for a long time, but I hesitate when I see the busty red-haired character on the front, because I have a personal theory that if the cover art comes down to a "rapetastic" (as Andrew put it) female on the front and not much else, I tend to be wary of it.
On an aside, I would love to see another martial arts based RPG. If I was good at making RPGs with like RPG Maker 3 or the rpg maker for PCs, I would go that route.
This is what I mean about making an old-school, low-cost gaming company. Take the classics and retool them to bring them into the modern day.
Obi Chris Kenobi
Personal Text goes here, Venkman
I'll put some roms together of the RPGs I like, but chances are people already have them!
Psycho Penguin
Integral Poster
fazzle said:
Yeah, the first game has Yuri holding Alice on the cover. And as you'll see by the time SH Covenant ends.. she's not all she seems. I can't recommend those two games enough.
I haven't really gotten into Shadow Hearts because I don't like the Judgment Ring system at all. Save those timed ring taps for shit like golf games or something). Although Koudelka (PS1) was a very cool, if damn weird, experience. Plus the music is awesome (it's from the composer of Secret of Mana and Seiken Densetsu 3).
It's something I heard from a really creepy bastard at a con who played Melty Blood in the game room and also showed up to (and tried to dominate) the Type Moon panel there. He referred to some loli characters that way (also, "deliciously rapeable").
I don't think it counts if a female character actually looks over 13 years old.
It's something I heard from a really creepy bastard at a con who played Melty Blood in the game room and also showed up to (and tried to dominate) the Type Moon panel there. He referred to some loli characters that way (also, "deliciously rapeable").
I don't think it counts if a female character actually looks over 13 years old.
Psycho Penguin
Integral Poster
I actually hated Koudelka because the battle system was so slow, and love Shadow Hearts for the Judgment Ring (hey, its original and makes you pay attention), but to each their own.
Kageho
@DSookochoff
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AndrewTS said:
Fucker I totally deleted what I said here. Here I go again.
No, I just mean gameplay is now a secondary to most people who play games. As long as they can enjoy the game without the gameplay causing too much problems, no one really cares except us who are true and true gamers who know the meat of a game is the game play.
BTW, don't you actually mean Nippon Ichi, not Gust? Cause I'm quite sure Nippon Ichi games have WAY more lolis in them than Gust. Gust's problem is broken code/game play. And the Nippon Ichi problem of most games having lolis can also be credited to the fact that demons being young and "terrible" are always the best way to go for hilarity.
As for Atlus' translation of Disgaea, does that really effect that Nippon Ichi is the one who made Disgaea? Sure NISA's translations borderlin'e on absolute stupidity somedays (Cross Edge), but that doesn't discount that the game wasn't made by Atlus. It also caters to us, the niche community. Though even I've gotta say "yo! Something new dammit" and I like Nippon Ichi.
Psycho Penguin said:
Actually, I forgot to mention that Atelier Marie will be coming state side.
Xenosaga 2, Shadow Hearts 3, and Tales of Legendia all have something that keeps them from being truly worthy of totally not playing. All the other games borderline near bad, but have some good qualities too them. Ephermal Fantasia actually was quite ingenious in how you kept repeating the same story, but could change things by learning about them and running through it a second time. The only downside was to correct things was to play a magic flute which never came stateside and totally killed the way it was meant to be played.
Can you clarify something? You put Lost Odyssey and Tales of Vesperia in the same sentence for being "bad" and then put it in the good with Eternal Sonata, could you please clarify if you mean its bad or good. Lost Odyssey isn't really bad either. Its more along the same lines as Xenogears in a game that likely got slashed in production to fit into the schedule. I mean there's no way you can tell me all the dragging on disc two and the rest is totally meant. Also would've been nice for them to include the actual back notes as playable scenes. That would've been much better.
Think you probably meant Valkyrie Chronicles, but I won't guess on that.
As for Tales of Vesperia, I'm not judging that game until we see the proper release on the PS3. I say proper simply because the Xbox really got a payable beta copy and you miss a large chunk of the story that will be release on the PS3. Which is Patty's storyline as well as Flynn's (who's going to be playable).
I'm not saying the rom doesn't fix the slowdowns, but I find that I enjoyed the actual storyline and translation done by DeJap (you know what, I really don't care if I say who anymore) than I do Namco's own. Namco's feels dry and stale.
Hm... Which martial arts based one are you thinking of? The only one that I can seem to recall being any good was Shenmue, and it sadly will never get a 3rd game.Rendclaw said:
Doing the classics and updating is what some fledgling companies are doing. The teams that made FFIII and the DS update games aren't Square, but a company that's being outsourced by Square.
If you mean making classic games, but totally updating the graphical style and gameplay, wouldn't that be doing what BlazBlue did?
Psycho Penguin
Integral Poster
Oh, I meant they were really classic games amongst the crap out there now. Like FF6 and Chrono Trigger were the classics amongsto crap like Secret of the Stars and 7th Saga.
Kageho said:
Yes, wacky and over the top goofy. I'll admit I barely played Disgaea 2 (and 3 being on PS3 is a sick joke), but nearly all those "loli" games feature the same main artist, Takehito Harada. And it seems generally more cartoony than fetishistic (rule 34 + Disgaea's popularity insures that some of the fandom goes that route, though). On the other hand, there's the downright-bootylicious-by-anime-standards Prier. But no one bought her game.
Gust, by contrast, seems deliberately sleazy too. Not just content wise, but "hey! Buy the soundtrack, the poster, the wall scrolls, the figurines!!" It seems like from the word go they're ready to merchandise it out the ass.I don't know whether to blame the localization or the original script for this, though:
Funny cutscene- Ar tonelico - Melody of Elemia
Also, it seems no one wants to accept the developer blame for Cross Edge, either. One of the most promoted features is dressing the female characters in fetish costumes!
Kageho
@DSookochoff
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AndrewTS said:Yes, wacky and over the top goofy. I'll admit I barely played Disgaea 2 (and 3 being on PS3 is a sick joke), but nearly all those "loli" games feature the same main artist, Takehito Harada. And it seems generally more cartoony than fetishistic (rule 34 + Disgaea's popularity insures that some of the fandom goes that route, though). On the other hand, there's the downright-bootylicious-by-anime-standards Prier. But no one bought her game.
I don't know whether to blame the localization or the original script for this, though:
(look at his original post for original link, I'm not keeping for my reply)
Also, it seems no one wants to accept the developer blame for Cross Edge, either. One of the most promoted features is dressing the female characters in fetish costumes!
I think the problem was Prier was considered "fat" instead of the more common "she's actually realisticly looking and down right fine". That and Disgaea 2 bombed so they went back to kiddy for 3. And yes, Gust is quite terrible for its merchandising habits, I'll agree with you on that point. Also yes, I agree, Disgaea 3 on PS3 was a joke, but then again, made it funny too...
I got a chance, before NISA went dead silent on their own boards, to talk to the translator for AT and that's exactly how it is. Its like that with all the Revs, which actually makes sense since you need to get them to be your partner.
As for Cross Edge, I'm quite disappointed it was only the girls who got costume changes and that they were just fetish induced. I was honestly expecting them to make some cool variation suits and some outlandish stuff to wear. Make some guys dress up as other characters and what not.
I'd blame them all for that one, seriously all of them.
You know whoever started this thread, change the name to The RPG Central Topic, that's pretty much what we are using this for now. ^_^