WWF Ruthless Aggression (2002- 2008)

[strummer]

Stephanie left creative sometime after WM 29 so she wasn't in charge during the authority stuff. So all in all she led creative for close to 13 years

 

[Big Papa Paegan]

13 egregiously aggravating years

 

[Cackling Co Pilot Kamala]

13 ruthlessly aggravating years

EFA

 

[Cackling Co Pilot Kamala]

https://fb.watch/nN1VOo3prU/?mibextid=v7YzmG

 

[Valeyard]

It fits here better but when I see Takeshita he reminds me of what Kenzo should've been.

 

[Cackling Co Pilot Kamala]

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This explains Jeff vibing out at Teddy Long’s wedding on that one Smackdown.

 

[BruiserBrody]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1716453113069023589

Really hated the devaluing of the SD! brand by putting 10 year JTTS into the main event mix on PPVs.

 

[Valeyard]

It wasn't bad, though. It wasn't like it headlined or that people took it seriously. People forgot about it 20 minutes later.

 

[Cackling Co Pilot Kamala]

Yeah because Triple H and Shawn Michaels lulled them to sleep.

 

[Valeyard]

Their match wasn't bad, either, but I cared as much. Anyone who says anything on that show mattered except Eddie's match and the Rumble are lying, and Eddie's only mattered because of it being the end of the midcard era.

 

[Cackling Co Pilot Kamala]

Their match length got halved too a few minutes before they went on. If it was 12 minutes instead of 6, I think it’d have been much more fondly remembered.

 

[Valeyard]

HHH/Shawn's problem is that it was the usual solid match that went too long. Young Bucks Disease. I think they had maybe three singles matches that were good and one of those was in 1996, but that Raw match at the end of 2003 is one of those moments where it feels like a change happens for me. Like it was clear HHH found motivation again and they had a great match that made you interested in more matches, then HHH has the best year he'd had since coming back and Shawn goes next level.

 

[Cackling Co Pilot Kamala]

Sell in a Cell has got to be the low point for Triple H vanity booking. Right after that, the Evolution dissension starts and we get his sloooow phase out as a full time main eventer.

 

[Valeyard]

There's a cage match between Diesel and Yokozuna that's just as good but a third as long.

 

[Fall of Epic]

IIRC, Lesnar and Holly had a rematch on SD! a few weeks later to very little fanfare. That's how low Holly sunk down the card after Royal Rumble '04. Like, he couldn't event get a lower card spot at WM that year.

Holly is one of those veterans I'm surprised has kept a relatively low profile since leaving. Hoping Carny Connie doesn't see this post and we get the Hardcore Truth weekly on AdFreeShows.com.

 

[alkeiper]

Young Bucks disease doesn't do enough to blame Triple H. To me he's the king of dull, long, formulaic matches. Matches where you could skip the first ten minutes of every HHH/Orton match and be reasonably confident you didn't miss anything.

 

[Valeyard]

HHH and Orton had terrible chemistry, to be fair. They had the one last man standing that was good and the first two minutes or whatever of Wrestlemania. Flukey moments.

 

[Fall of Epic]

The reign of terror was awful but you kind of have to be endeared that it was HHH trying desperately to be the next Flair or Race.

 

[Cackling Co Pilot Kamala]

IIRC, Lesnar and Holly had a rematch on SD! a few weeks later to very little fanfare. That's how low Holly sunk down the card after Royal Rumble '04. Like, he couldn't event get a lower card spot at WM that year.

Ykw is crazy? Hardcore Holly was in WWE for 15 years and was only in three WrestleMania matches and two of them were battle royals.

That’s got to be high up there for longest tenure with fewest WrestleMania appearances for a non jobber. Titus O’Neil is probably going to pass him soon.

Holly says he was supposed to be in Umaga’s spot in the Battle of the Billionaires at WrestleMania 23 but I find that claim highly dubious despite how much I enjoyed his brief WWECW run during that era.

 

[Fall of Epic]

I can definitely see that being promised to him without any serious consideration behind it.

 

[Valeyard]

Should've been Snitsky's spot.

 

[alkeiper]

I have a hard time believing Snitsky would oppose Donald Trump

 

[Brocklock]

HHH and Orton had terrible chemistry, to be fair. They had the one last man standing that was good and the first two minutes or whatever of Wrestlemania. Flukey moments.

And the reason that LMS was good was that it felt like a Cena match with Triple H plugged in.

 

[Valeyard]

And oddly Orton/Cena matches always suck.

Man Orton is really not good if you think about it for a minute.

 

[Big Papa Paegan]

And oddly Orton/Cena matches always suck.

Man Orton is really not good if you think about it for a minute.

Orton would have been considered a top 5 worker if he had the same exact style in, say, 1993. The problem is that the average quality of match had increased so much between 1993 and 2003 that his style was bound to be dull unless he was getting the shit kicked out of him (as he still has the best "I just KTFO'd" sell I've ever seen).

And I still hold that Orton/Cena from SummerSlam '07 was a thing of beauty, if only for the meta-troll it was.

RE: HHH's Reign of Terra (seewhatididthere)
I said it then, and I hold onto it still, but the only good part was that everyone was so incredibly interested in seeing whoever took the belt from him that good near-falls against him in that period got a lot of heat. The downside was everything else, but it wasn't like we had too many options elsewhere to see how a ME heel should be properly booked (except for, ya know, Kurt and Brock).

 

[Valeyard]

Orton's as basic as it gets. He was and is a pretty boring template. Everything I've liked has way less to do with him than those he's working with. You can argue both injury and Evolution stunted him if you go by his style as a worker and a promo from RNN and earlier. Faster, long haired Orton had things going for him much more than RKO Orton did and would've gotten over years faster.

Really I don't think there's many good Orton singles matches. The last man standing with HHH, the Foley match, the first Edge match, Benoit, the Wrestlemanias with Taker and Seth, and there's probably a couple more buried in there but definitely not enough to justify his longevity.

 

[BruiserBrody]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1280641174546649088

Should be the way Vince is finally written off.

 

[Valeyard]

Dawn Marie might be a scammer but she was the best

 

[Cackling Co Pilot Kamala]

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[Valeyard]

I hope he's still friends with Tough Enough people. He might still know Bobbie Jo.