Maybe the studios shouldn't have waited too long to do this. Also, there are several POC/Women/LGBTQ people who are actual film critics/filmlovers that are tired of these, so I wouldn't say it's a mostly a bunch of Gamer Gate style idiots who are tired of these at this point. Also, it's not the actors and directors fault these movies are underperforming all the sudden. Blame the overabundance of capeshit and the mostly declining quality of the MCU
And I don't know why you would think that these POC/Women/LGBTQ critics haven't internalized white supremacy/misogyny/homophobia? Because when we're talking about these reviews, how the critics choose to frame their reviews and what they attribute the declining interest to cannot be undersold. As far as waiting too long, well, the studios that make these movies aren't run by GamerGate types, either, and I rather doubt that the fact that the first woman-led MCU movie wasn't until 19 movies in, even though a woman was a founding member of the Avengers was a coincidence.
I will not. And the reason I will not is because nobody thought that there was an "overabundance of capeshit" when they thought the movies were good. It's possible that I'm the only person on earth that thinks that the movies are still good (I know for a fact that I'm not, but it's definitely not reflected in the box office receipts) but, even stipulating for the sake of discourse that they're not, framing your critiques of CBMs as though the declining interest is because people are tired of them, and not because they've been mid is intentional, like you're trying to will it into existence or something. Everybody was talking "fatigue" after Ant-Man 3, and then Guardians 3 made $845MM. Why was GOTG3 immune to "fatigue?"
Because it's good and "Antman 3" sucks. The fact it's supposed to be the final one (at least until Feige decides otherwise) also helps. Also, no offense, but the idea that POC/Women/LGBTQ critics that dislike these movies because of internalized racism/misogyny/homophobia reeks of arguing in bad faith. Please tell that to Wesley Morris-an open gay black man who is a film critic, or Angelica Jade Bastién-a black woman who is a film critic-that they dislike these movies because of internalized self hatred. I'm admittedly probably the last man who should talk about this kind of thing since I'm a white heterosexual man, but they can think for themselves ya know.
Well, offense taken, because you kind of moved the goalposts on me. I accused people who blame the decline in interest in CBMs on fatigue of racism and misogyny, and I do not believe that other POC and women are immune to that. You shifted to accusing me of saying that they disliked the movies because of racism and misogyny (EDIT - And then had the nerve to accuse me of arguing in bad faith!). You could have disliked a couple of CBMs and still not be sick of them: those things don't go hand-in-hand, IMO.
I found two articles written by Ms. Bastién (and none by Mr. Morris) in which she wrote about comic book movies, and neither of them seem to suggest any level of CBM fatigue, so I don't think that we're talking about the same things here. Because I didn't say that nobody had valid criticisms of these movies, nor did I accuse everyone who was critical of the movies of supporting white supremacy/misogyny/homophobia/etc. I am specifically talking about the people who bring up the "fatigue" talking point. Ms. Bastién wrote a very critical review of Wakanda Forever: I disagree pretty strongly with a lot of it, but I can see how she got there. At no point in her review did she suggest that people were getting tired of CBMs. Even in her review of The Flash, in which she was rather more critical, she didn't imply that the movie flopped because of fatigue. Like, if you thought Blue Beetle flopped because you thought it was a bad movie, that's one thing, especially if you articulate what you thought was bad about it in your review. If you say that Blue Beetle flopped because of "fatigue," I'm looking at you sideways.
Because there have been too many of them, and like all kinds of genres of the past (Westerns and Musicals for example) some of us start to grow tired or think “gee, it would be great if things that aren’t just big franchise films like Marvel got a chance”. I’m not saying “oh it’s bad to like these” because go ahead, watch them. Just don’t get mad whenever someone points out 1.) these aren’t doing as well as they used to, 2.) some of us aren’t as enthusiastic, and 3.) yeah, there is a consensus among some of us (even some people who used to and still like these) that they aren’t as good as they used to be.
Okay, but to the first point, westerns and musicals (especially musicals) aren't serials; they're not designed to be "never-ending" in the way that comic books are. Like, I guess Gunsmoke was kind of a serial, but how many decades did it take for people to get sick of that?
... And I only get "mad" depending on what people theorize the reason for 2) is.
Movie audiences are mostly different from comic book audiences because yeah, after a while if there's too much of something, they will get tired of it.
variety.com
Also, they’re considering bringing back Iron Man, Black Widow and others, and…lol.Crisis at Marvel: Jonathan Majors Back-Up Plans, ‘The Marvels’ Reshoots, Reviving Original Avengers and More Issues Revealed
Marvel has enjoyed a nearly uninterrupted string of hits ever since it started independently producing its movies with 2008’s “Iron Man.”
This explains a lot
Another problem is that only a few of these actually feel like the work of directors with a particular stamp. Something like the "Guardians" movies stand out because they are from a guy who actually wants to make movies instead of just product, and you can tell they are also personal films. Compare that to something like "Civil War" or "Captain Marvel", which feel like could've been made by anyone. They just feel like corporate product instead of something with a particular style or vision.
There's also the problem of them making too much of this kind of thing post "Endgame". It could be said "well, you're supposed to stay with it and watch it all. Like how you need to read the comics to get ahead of everything" and to that I say that a good portion of the audience probably doesn't even read comics and aren't going to have that level of patience. After a while, making all that content becomes exhausting, and people are going to get tired of it.
This also just presents something that for me is terrifying-the idea of using the language of social justice to embolden consumerism. That convincing people that watching the new Disney product being presented as an act of social justice when it just feeds our capitalist masters. Sure, you may like "Black Panther" and it's sequel, but that isn't doing anything when it comes to the bigger picture. It's merely feeding and paying those that hold people down while creating the illusion of social progress.
Yeah. People were pointing this out during the start of the latest PC rush back in...what? 2014ish? The same thing happened in the 90s. Corporations catch on to the cultural wave and abuse it for profit. A tale as old as capitalism itself.
Just found out this has writers from "Better Call Saul", so my "no more Marvel stuff after Guardians 3" rule might end up being broken. The fact it's also airing on Hulu is a plus.
There was a writer who was involved in the script pre-strike on Twitter yesterday who refuted the article where this claim was made, but I didn't have the presence of mind to bookmark it, and of course now I can't find it (it wasn't somebody I follow) because it's been buried under the avalanche of shit that's flooded my timeline since then. That said, call me what you will, but I'll take the scriptwriter's word for it over the person who did that article who, as I understand it, has been accused of having an anti-Marvel agenda.
I have a different perspective on that. I mean, I agree that Blade was created to capitalize on the cult popularity of the Blaxploitation era but, the thing about Blade is that there's nothing about Blade's origin story or the character's mythology that is intrinsically Black. It's the reason why I like to say that Blade was the first blockbuster Black superhero movie, but Black Panther was the first blockbuster Black superhero movie. Because there are no essential stories featuring Blade, pre-1996 or so (or whenever the first movie came out) where Blade's blackness is relevant to the plot. You could go back to the seventies and make Blade any other race, and literally nothing about his characterization or mythology would change, which is something you can't say about, say, Storm or T'Challa, or even Bill Foster. It wasn't until after the popularity of the movies that Marvel actually wrote some Blade stories where Blade's blackness was actually relevant.
But haven't you guys been saying that too many movies has been part of the problem?
