he claimed AEW doesn't pay for hotels and TK refuted it and it's lead to several talent also saying how wrong he is, including Jericho who is someone Dave talks to regularly. How hard is it to just confirm this shit?
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The Meltzer Thread
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he claimed AEW doesn't pay for hotels and TK refuted it and it's lead to several talent also saying how wrong he is, including Jericho who is someone Dave talks to regularly. How hard is it to just confirm this shit?
BUTT
Kreese
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You'd think it would be a big deal that hotels and transportation are taken care of, and also something Tony would want to publicize so that wrestlers knew they were better taken care of in AEW than in WWE. Strange than in four years nobody has mentioned this to Dave. Maybe he's telling the truth when he says he talks to way more people in WWE than AEW.
BUTT
Kreese
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Dave on the F4W board saying that he was specifically talking about WWE. And I can't find the original tweet he was responding to but upon further inspection it's clear he was talking about WWE because "overseas" doesn't apply to AEW, at least not yet. Meltz redeemed again. Haters back off, go back to saying he made Manami Toyota blow him for star ratings. MDF
BruiserBrody
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Bryan describes his AEW buddies while shitting on NXT.
BruiserBrody
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Not a parody.
If he wants to argue that there are better athletes and guys are in better shape than sure I'll give him that. But If he wants to argue that this is the best group of wrestlers ever thats an entirely different matter. The shit AJPW was putting out in the 90's was on a different level. And they weren't the only ones.
Big Papa Paegan
L. A. Z.
Maybe Dave is a victim of autocorrect and his brother is a professional ICP fan.
Cackling Co Pilot Kamala
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I mean in terms of athletic skill and ability, today's NBA/MLB/NFL (and I assume NHL but I don't watch enough of it) is better than its ever been. But as seen in the NBA Playoffs thread, if you ask to put the best 5 players of 2023 against the best 5 players of 2003, 99% of people are gonna pick the 2003 team. Just because it's better, doesn't necessarily mean it's gotten smarter. If that makes sense.
If Meltzer honestly thinks he would pick the top 5 wrestlers of today (domestic, international or otherwise) over the top 5 wrestlers of 2003 or 1993, he's lying to himself IMO.
If Meltzer honestly thinks he would pick the top 5 wrestlers of today (domestic, international or otherwise) over the top 5 wrestlers of 2003 or 1993, he's lying to himself IMO.
alkeiper
Welcoming our new insect overlords
Athletically, they probably are better. But there’s more to wrestling than athleticism. Wrestlers also need to be actors, play to the crowd, have charisma, etc. To draw in Dave’s analogy, there are probably better jugglers but the ones who have the best acts are the ones with showmanship.
Cackling Co Pilot Kamala
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And Sting still has entertaining matches today. How many of today’s wrestlers could have thrived in 2003?
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BruiserBrody
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I'm trying to think of guys who even did much "major" stuff in their 40s after 1990. (Lawler, Funk....)
Those 80s guys sure fell off fast. The UWF was 91ish and most of their crew do not give the vibe of being fresh even in a new environment several years removed from TV. Global and other Texas indies kept the same core of WCCW/Wild West guys employed for a bit with no real impact.
Michael Hayes was like 32 in 1992 and felt like a relic of another era as he bounced around WCW and Texas indies.
Buddy Rose was 400 pounds and lost all his agility by the early 90s. He turned 40 right after his WWF jobber run.
Billy Jack Haynes turned 40 in 1993.
Don Muraco was 39 when the WWF fired him.
Orton Jr turned 40 in 1990.
Honky turned 40 in 1993.
And so on.
BruiserBrody
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A few more 40 times:
Rick Martel - 1996! - Already mostly retired
Hercules - 1996 - Washed for years
JYD -1992 - Bloated and limping
Beefcake - 1997!!! - Already an also ran and on his 200th gimmick
The Mountie - 2000!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! - He felt like a relic from another time during his 1998 run.
Butch Reed - 1994 - Basically out of business.
Steamboat - 1993 - a top guy in the mix
Bigelow - 2001 - washed and rotting in hospice WCW after his late 90s revival
Duggan -1994 - His last hurrah as a truly pushed talent, which was not well received by the hardcore WCW base
Ron Bass - 1988 - months away from retirement
Jim Brunzell - 1989 - jobbing his life away less than 5 years after headlining in the midwest
Davey Boy Smith - dead
Barry Darsow - 1999 - Comedy JTTS
Hammer Valentine - 1991 - One last mini push before spending the 90s being looked at as an old timer.
MENG - 1999 - Still in the middle of a fun push. Somehow up there with Duggan and Steamboat on this list.
Akeem - 2000 - semi retired and almost 5 years out of the mainstream. Where was his ironic late era WCW Russo push?
THE ROAD WILL OWN YOU.
Rick Martel - 1996! - Already mostly retired
Hercules - 1996 - Washed for years
JYD -1992 - Bloated and limping
Beefcake - 1997!!! - Already an also ran and on his 200th gimmick
The Mountie - 2000!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! - He felt like a relic from another time during his 1998 run.
Butch Reed - 1994 - Basically out of business.
Steamboat - 1993 - a top guy in the mix
Bigelow - 2001 - washed and rotting in hospice WCW after his late 90s revival
Duggan -1994 - His last hurrah as a truly pushed talent, which was not well received by the hardcore WCW base
Ron Bass - 1988 - months away from retirement
Jim Brunzell - 1989 - jobbing his life away less than 5 years after headlining in the midwest
Davey Boy Smith - dead
Barry Darsow - 1999 - Comedy JTTS
Hammer Valentine - 1991 - One last mini push before spending the 90s being looked at as an old timer.
MENG - 1999 - Still in the middle of a fun push. Somehow up there with Duggan and Steamboat on this list.
Akeem - 2000 - semi retired and almost 5 years out of the mainstream. Where was his ironic late era WCW Russo push?
THE ROAD WILL OWN YOU.
BruiserBrody
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I'm intrigued by this age 40 thing so here's one more round:
Larry Zybyszko - 1991 - His last full year before being shunted off to commentary. His 1994 comeback seems a little less neat given current context.
Luger - 1998 - Feels about right. He fell off big from 97 at least as far as a push and felt like an old guy by 2001.
Scott Norton - 2001 - Never got a sniff at the WWF (Nor TNA????)
Curt Hennig - 1998- His late 1997 push vanished largely as the WCW shuffle struck again. Then in 99 he was used as a Washed guy who they were trying to force into retirement.
Rick Rude - 1998 - About to die.
Barry Windham - 2000!!! - Years removed from injuries killing his mojo. He was doing indies/Japan after WCW. Another guy hurt somewhat by being a star early in his career so he felt long in the tooth.
Tully - 1994 - Looked older than that in the 80s already.
Sid - 2000 - broken leg ended his mainstream days at the end of the year. (Did he do TNA???? Can't recall????)
Warlord - 2002 - Wow! Basically a decade out of the big leagues, minus his WCW shots. Didn't he have a car accident injury or something???
Scott Hall - 1998 - On the downside. About to get sadder as the years progress.
Brad Armstrong - 2001- Another guy who was on national TV super early so he felt dated. Jobbing for years and years didn't help.
Ricky Morton - 1996 - SMW was done, so he was stuck on WCW TV doing jobs. Never refreshing the gimmick didn't help his cause.
Abby the Butcher - 1981!!! - So when he was electrocuted in 1991 in WCW he was 50!
Manny Fernandez - 1994!! - Yikes! So he burned his JCP bridge at 33 after being a guy in the mix for years.
33!!!!
Arn Anderson - retired
Larry Zybyszko - 1991 - His last full year before being shunted off to commentary. His 1994 comeback seems a little less neat given current context.
Luger - 1998 - Feels about right. He fell off big from 97 at least as far as a push and felt like an old guy by 2001.
Scott Norton - 2001 - Never got a sniff at the WWF (Nor TNA????)
Curt Hennig - 1998- His late 1997 push vanished largely as the WCW shuffle struck again. Then in 99 he was used as a Washed guy who they were trying to force into retirement.
Rick Rude - 1998 - About to die.
Barry Windham - 2000!!! - Years removed from injuries killing his mojo. He was doing indies/Japan after WCW. Another guy hurt somewhat by being a star early in his career so he felt long in the tooth.
Tully - 1994 - Looked older than that in the 80s already.
Sid - 2000 - broken leg ended his mainstream days at the end of the year. (Did he do TNA???? Can't recall????)
Warlord - 2002 - Wow! Basically a decade out of the big leagues, minus his WCW shots. Didn't he have a car accident injury or something???
Scott Hall - 1998 - On the downside. About to get sadder as the years progress.
Brad Armstrong - 2001- Another guy who was on national TV super early so he felt dated. Jobbing for years and years didn't help.
Ricky Morton - 1996 - SMW was done, so he was stuck on WCW TV doing jobs. Never refreshing the gimmick didn't help his cause.
Abby the Butcher - 1981!!! - So when he was electrocuted in 1991 in WCW he was 50!
Manny Fernandez - 1994!! - Yikes! So he burned his JCP bridge at 33 after being a guy in the mix for years.
33!!!!
Arn Anderson - retired
Cackling Co Pilot Kamala
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It’s funny I triggered a Brodesplain because it was all based on a typo!
Point I was trying to make that wrestlers of Sting’s generation can adapt into old age well . Today’s wrestlers couldn’t have a good match in 2003 and presumably won’t be able to be wrestling at Sting’s level when they are 63. Although with the way sports medicine is evolving, who knows?
Point I was trying to make that wrestlers of Sting’s generation can adapt into old age well . Today’s wrestlers couldn’t have a good match in 2003 and presumably won’t be able to be wrestling at Sting’s level when they are 63. Although with the way sports medicine is evolving, who knows?
alkeiper
Welcoming our new insect overlords
Shame that today's wrestlers couldn't meet the high standards set by Orlando Jordan and the Basham Brothers.
Cackling Co Pilot Kamala
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OK. WWE’s roster might be better overall now than it was in June of 2003. Maybe
The way I would put it is that just because you have the tools to make something better, doesn't mean that it's going to be better. I'd rather have a 69 Mustang than any car they make now.
There's been a lot of great matches this year, but when you get to saying what the best stuff was, most of the absolute best matches this year are with guys just beating the crap out of each other. Like DMT Azul/Blue Demon vs. Rush and LA Park. Three of those guys aren't exactly young and they do things that other wrestlers have been doing for 30 or 40 years. Jericho vs. Strong was just a 90s style Attitude Era arena brawl but how often do we see that anymore? You don't get stuff like that in WWE so WWE is basically almost completely ruined for me, and yeah I would take umbrage with anyone saying it's better. Variety there is gone.
There's been a lot of great matches this year, but when you get to saying what the best stuff was, most of the absolute best matches this year are with guys just beating the crap out of each other. Like DMT Azul/Blue Demon vs. Rush and LA Park. Three of those guys aren't exactly young and they do things that other wrestlers have been doing for 30 or 40 years. Jericho vs. Strong was just a 90s style Attitude Era arena brawl but how often do we see that anymore? You don't get stuff like that in WWE so WWE is basically almost completely ruined for me, and yeah I would take umbrage with anyone saying it's better. Variety there is gone.
Valeyard
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I tried to word it in a way that sounded intelligent, but I'm just going to shorten my thoughts to thinking WWE's overall roster is better than it was in 2003 but there's no one I like now the same way I did Eddie or Benoit back then.
If I was in 20 I probably would like Roman as much as I liked Eddie and Benoit as I did then. I can't reach that level of enthusiasm now.
BruiserBrody
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If we expand it to Japan and Mexico though there are STILL guys from the 80's who are wrestling, some of them at a high level. There are guys from the 70's!
geniusMoment
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Ya know what, good for Missy. All told she’s doing fairly well given her peers and seems comfortably happy about herself.
I’m sure @Birthday King Kamala will drag up some tweet she made a half decade ago about pro life or supporting the police or some nebulous bullshit but I still don’t care really because she kept her giant fake tits after all these years.
I’m sure @Birthday King Kamala will drag up some tweet she made a half decade ago about pro life or supporting the police or some nebulous bullshit but I still don’t care really because she kept her giant fake tits after all these years.