Kamala's Random WCW Bullshit thread

[Cackling Co Pilot Kamala]

In retrospect, a lot of ‘98 is just as bad as ‘99-‘00 but they were riding such a hot hand from ‘96-‘97 that people didn’t really notice. Kind of like how SNL started getting bad in ‘93 but they were riding the Wayne’s World wave and people didn’t realize “Hey. The show really sucks and now I hate Chris Farley and Adam Sandler.” until ‘95.

So is Chris Farley Hogan and Adam Sandler or Nash in this analogy, @BruiserBrody ?

 

[Valeyard]

Like as someone who has gotten to appreciate WCW more in retrospect than I did at the time, there's just something about 1998 and beyond I have a really hard time sitting through. The great stuff is really great, of course, but the gulf is extreme. Starrcade 98 is a perfect example, albeit an extreme one.

Also the shows visually look like shit after a while, not that WCW shows looked good but they seriously drained all color from everything

 

[Big Papa Paegan]

...that's literally my favorite era of SNL...

 

[BruiserBrody]

...that's literally my favorite era of SNL...

Yup, Kamala your stepping on people of a certain age's nostalgia goggles here.

 

[BruiserBrody]

Brody: Rolls eyes at AEW bringing in over the hill talents.

Also Brody: Marks out

 

[Cackling Co Pilot Kamala]

Yup, Kamala your stepping on people of a certain age's nostalgia goggles here.

It is a lot lof people’s favorite era of SNL but cheesebreath TV critics hated it.

Norm Macdonald had a great story about this magazine story. The writer embedded himself with the show for a month and was absolutely loving it and cracking up at Farley’s antics. A month later, they come out with a feature about how horrible SNL is and Chris Farley is the most unholy of hacks.

 

[BruiserBrody]

Problem with the email question is he doesn't account for Russo not starting until Oct so Taz is likely already WWF bound and the Dudleys are gonzo so there's a few major cogs not in the works.

November to Remember (1999) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Most guys go straight to WCW Sat night and knock some power plant guys out as jabronis. RVD is the lone guy who could move into the mix, but the main event scene after the summer of suck is clogged with stars who suddenly feel stale and don't really fit with what RVD could do.
Sabu might get a little push for a bit to use whatever buzz he had left, but he's destined for the hardcore trash heap w/Dreamer and Sandman.
Actually he and RVD probably get stuck in the tag division as Heyman sorts out the main event mess.
Raven just escaped this shit, so he may just bow out and head to Vince at first light.
The cruiser division is bolstered at least.
If Heyman manages not to get fired, Beniot, Malenko and Eddy probably get elevated in 00 instead of quitting.
Kronus might get a gig to reform the Eliminators.

 

[Valeyard]

RVD gets the upper midcard rocket push Lance Storm got. Probably some great Booker/RVD matches happen. We probably still get a Team Canada but Storm isn't knocking on the door nearly as hard as he ended up.

Taz and the Dudleys go to the WWF anyway. The WWF was still the top company and I think they know how bullshit WCW is. Taz succeeds, though, because in the event the Radicalz don't jump he isn't immediately usurped by great midgets like he ended up being. Dreamer would probably end up running ECW instead of going to WCW and being a joke. Sandman wouldn't give a fuck but I don't know that, if you gave Heyman the chance on that level, he cares enough to bring him considering the talent level is pretty steep compared to literally WCW. But guys like Lynn, Guido, Tajiri, Mikey, Crazy, Credible, etc. take over the cruiserweight division with pretty mixed results since you just know Credible dragging Rey or Kidman down happens a lot.

Radicalz stay but they're still fucked with because of creative control. The divide will be gigantic but literally every title but the world title becomes worthwhile. However, if Bret doesn't get hurt, it could be pretty different. Jarrett might not come in if Russo doesn't book, and in that case there actually could be a spot for a good worker up the card. Maybe RVD takes the Chosen One spot.

If the Radicalz leave, Heyman would be able to create a new base of strong workers. Thunder Four! Nitro Nine! Whatever, he can just pair guys and let it happen. He clashes with the usual suspects but probably gets someone random like the Steiners to side with him. I can see Heyman appealing to Scott's craziness and putting the belt on him early.

 

[Big Papa Paegan]

Heyman in WCW wouldn't have worked. Period. Heyman, as a booker, needs autonomy, and he'd have immediately butted heads with Turner brass (especially Standards & Practices) to the point where he's looking for a new job within a few months. That's not even in terms of the sex and violence aspect that Heyman thrived in, but more how he'd be putting guys like Hogan, Flair, Savage, etc. on the chopping block as soon as he could.

Bluntly put, Heyman taking Russo's WCW spot hurts the business more than what happens, and WCW's demise is accelerated because most of the Turner contracts become worthless but costly.

Now, let's say that happens, and he's looking for work in early 2000. Well, there's this company up north that he's had a good rapport with for a few years, and he ends up working there off/on for 20ish years in our timeline, and they're on some form of cruise control after Russo leaves (this is assuming Russo still leaves)...

Basically, we get the awesomeness of WWF in the year 2000, but it has an even greater emphasis on workrate, episodic storytelling involving logical twists and turns, and maybe a Light Heavyweight division that crosses paths with the Hardcore division to become its own thing.

I'd love to have been able to see what Heyman could've done with Goldberg's rehab, Bret Hart, and DDP. Of those three, I feel Page would be the one most willing to work with Paul E, because he'd proven time and again that he'd do his best with whatever's handed to him.

 

[Valeyard]

Heyman would try to play ball with the big names initially because he had ideas for them. Like in 2002 he really, really wanted to run Benoit/Hogan. But there's no way any of that kind of elevation or uniqueness is able to happen, so I think he'd just end up doing what was already basically done and putting all the main eventers on their own island of rotating ego.

But the angle I really want to see is Heyman booking the New Blood/Millionaires Club. I don't think it would end any differently, really, but I think Heyman would have known how to make it succeed at least moderately for the young guys.

I don't think network issues hit Heyman as hard as that, but they're an issue. The hardcore division and the Nitro Girls existed, and guys were allowed to swear more at the time. They'd run miscarriage angles and shit. Heyman has a lot more room than you'd think as long as he doesn't have a gay tag team or something. PPV picks up a lot of slack, too, and while it won't be ECW it could definitely hit the 2002-5 WWE PG13. I don't think it hurts the business. If anything it gives Heyman a lot more goodwill and points WCW in a better direction...until he really does get fired and they bring Russo in anyway.

 

[Cackling Co Pilot Kamala]

Heyman is a lot better at working with a team and “eating shit and liking it”(boy, that’s a Vinceism that seems a thousand times darker now) than a lot of people are giving him credit for. Granted, he wasn’t as humbled as he would be but I think if it was financially advantageous for him, he’d be 100x better of a fit than Russo.

Yeah, he’d headbutt with the Millionaires Club guys but for all of his bluster and bravado, he is an old school wrestling guy at heart and has traveled down a lot of the same roads. He definitely wouldn’t be like “FUCK HULK HOGAN, BRO, THAT BALD PIECE OF GARBAGE!”

I don’t think he would have saved WCW but he definitely would’ve outlasted Vince Russo and maybe been able to buy it more time since he is more resilient than him (and Bischoff).

 

[Valeyard]

WCW was on borrowed time no matter what. Heyman would also know that and probably use them to jump to the WWF anyhow.

His WCW would look a lot more like his OVW run than ECW, I think. That's a really good thing though.

 

[Cackling Co Pilot Kamala]

I’m not saying Heyman buys WCW anything more than a year or two and that would be the most rose colored optimistic estimate. Wrestling business was going to be in the shitter by 2003, even if WCW was somehow able to get a more reasonable clone of Vince McMahon or a reincarnated Toots Mondt put in charge.

 

[Valeyard]

He maybe, like at absolute pie in the sky most, buys them a year. That said a lot can happen in a year. If Eddie gets fired and gets clean, maybe he jumps back to WCW if Heyman is there. ECW dies but maybe there is a place for everyone that isn't the WWF and we get Rhino/Goldberg and RVD/Booker for world titles. Maybe the old guard jump to the WWF and money is freed up. Maybe ROH gets raided and Punk becomes the hottest prospect since Austin.

 

[Big Papa Paegan]

ECW doesn't exist without Heyman at the helm, so if Heyman gets hired by WCW in late 1999 (and, realistically, that wasn't going to happen due to the feelings harbored by Heyman toward WCW and Turner as a whole) then ECW folds just as they're about to make national cable TV.

This means no Ring of Honor, because there wasn't an exciting indie scene in 1999 that Gabe and RF would use to bolster the latter's video distribution.

...it potentially means CZW gets more attention that much earlier, however. Or even XPW, as they were already running shows by then.

 

[Cackling Co Pilot Kamala]

Fox also really wanted to get into pro wrestling in ‘99/‘00, according to the WON notes of that era. Rupert Murdoch loves trash entertainment and hates Ted Turner. A little bit surprised it didn’t happened. It’d be easier for them to start one up and have it on FX without ECW in the way.

 

[Valeyard]

I see Dreamer taking over ECW but still having a similar trajectory. Dies in 2001 but probably more ECW Arena than Hammerstein. ROH in some form, maybe not in name, exists anyway because that audience is still there who want wrestling in its driest form. The indie scene is still bolstered by people leaving ECW and WCW.

ECW probably still get a network based on reputation and the state of the business but it goes about as well as it did. They survive only just but Dreamer is left with the mess and people leave when he tries to tighten purse strings. They never come back from something like Mike Awesome jumping but just chug.

 

[Cackling Co Pilot Kamala]

Fox also really wanted to get into pro wrestling in ‘99/‘00, according to the WON notes of that era. Rupert Murdoch loves trash entertainment and hates Ted Turner. A little bit surprised it didn’t happened. It’d be easier for them to start one up and have it on FX without ECW in the way.

Funniest/worst thing about this rumored promotion is they apparently wanted to build around Hulk Hogan so Rupert Murdoch could have been as bad at owning a wrestling promotion as he was at the Los Angeles Dodgers.

 

[BruiserBrody]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1759963128773668965

 

[Cackling Co Pilot Kamala]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1263413790013620224

 

[Big Papa Paegan]

SHOW ME "RAVISHING" RICK RUDE AND RANDY "MACHO MAN" SAVAGE IN THE CAGE OF DEATH, YOU COWARDS!!

 

[Cackling Co Pilot Kamala]

As a 9 year old, that was the first time I realized that movies took years to make. Rick Rude had been retired for three years when Liar Liar came out (and him and Macho Man hadn't been in the same company for 6-7 years!)

 

[Valeyard]

That movie sucks and I'm glad they cut something worthwhile. If Maura Tierney or Cary Elwes had gone to the show, it would've made the whole thing worth it.

 

[Big Papa Paegan]

Lousy take, jerk.

 

[strummer]

IIRC, WCW actually promoted that Sting was in the movie so of course his scene got cut

I don't think they mentioned Giant was in Jingle All the Way once

 

[Fall of Epic]

He was also in Reggie's Prayer which I also don't think they promoted.

 

[BruiserBrody]

He was also in Reggie's Prayer which I also don't think they promoted.

Still have my VHS copy like a good cheesehead.

IIRC it is actually up on Amazon prime.

It was supposed to be the first of at least 3 films by "Reggie White Studios"

Number 2 was announced at a presser with Reggie and Prime Time Deion IIRC. It was called "Barnstormers" and was supposed to be about the early days of football IIRC.

 

[Cackling Co Pilot Kamala]

Episode 146: The Magnificent Seven - My World with Jeff Jarrett

‘My World’ with Jeff Jarrett takes listeners on a journey through Jarrett’s illustrious Hall of Fame career as an in-the ring, main-event professional wrestler, to a promoter and company owner. Along with co-host Conrad Thompson, wrestling’s self-proclaimed “King of the Mountain” will look back...

pca.st

Most people: Why would they do a podcast on an old Western?”

Me: a podcast on one of WCW’s last and potentially most forgettable attempt to recapture the success of the nWo? Dammit. I’m in.

https://www.facebook.com/MyWorldPod/posts/pfbid0eZHg9cSrFTGyDvomcKnYB5ksHeVmbaUYxRWc9mvzV8keLUeSBCEsUEkwCNWUTwrMl

Dusty Rhodes delivering a stink face to Jeff Jarrett in front of an entire wide swath of empty seats screams “WCW’s last PPV”.

It is nice that WCW brought Dusty back at the end so ‘80s smarks could point their finger at him to blame for WCW’s death.

 

[Big Papa Paegan]

I still contend that the Magnificent Seven could've been the basis for the company's turnaround, if only because the guys involved were actually willing to put the right people over. Steiner/Booker was being set up as the next big long-term program, and Steiner clearly had no issue putting Booker over and making him look good.

 

[Cackling Co Pilot Kamala]

if only because the guys involved were actually willing to put the right people over.

Rick Steiner Bite/Not Me.
Totally Buff: only willing to put people over in most comically half assed way possible.
Road Warrior Animal: I’ll do whatever.I can’t believe I am working here. Thank goodness my brother got this job.