Old School Observations and Questions, 2024

[snuffbox]

What is shady about that effort?

 

[Valeyard]

I feel like Kamala is being very anti-Italian.

 

[Cackling Co Pilot Kamala]

John McAdam is the one who is being anti-Italian. I'm just trying to back up my fellow Irishman.

 

[Big Papa Paegan]

Heyyyyy, whattya mean-a, King-a Kamalla is-a fine young-a man!

 

[JN News]

20 years ago around this point in time, Vince decided to screw up his own product by drafting HHH to SD!, only to trade him back over to RAW, just to screw not just SD!, but also to screw RAW and guys like Edge, Jericho and everyone else on the red brand.

And push Bradshaw to the WWE Heavyweight Title (too soon, mind you), and cause so many SD! viewers to turn away from the blue brand.

If they really wanted to push JBL, I'd at least build him up at least to a year and a half first to make it mean more.

 

[BruiserBrody]

Totally agree. With his goofy shtick he should have gotten the US title and done his over the top jingoistic gimmick.

 

[Valeyard]

JBL/Cena in 2004 would've been huge for both guys in hindsight. Let Angle or someone beat Eddie. I was 100% sure that Simmons would cost him the match and we'd get APA Explodes until Summerslam.

The Great American Bash thread on the old board is amazing.

 

[strummer]

House show business completely tanked with JBL as champion. I think Dave said it was as bad or worse than Nash in 95

 

[snuffbox]

In retrospect, it was kind of an odd booking decision to push the weak link of a midcard tag team to the top of the card like that.

 

[JN News]

I would've kept HHH on SD! and had him and JBL form a heel alliance against Eddie Guerrero. Let's say that HHH (with help from JBL) feuds with Eddie and beats him for the WWE Heavyweight Title at SummerSlam. After that, I'd let you guys pitch in your ideas for afterwards.

I would've had the returning Edge be the "crown jewel" of RAW and slowly gave him his "Rated-R" gimmick. Let's say that I would give him that gimmick after watching some old ECW tapes, and what have you.

 

[Valeyard]

He needed at least another six months to hit the proper ceiling of a Taker villain. I found him entertaining as hell but the time and push were all wrong

 

[Valeyard]

I've said it before but if you switch Eddie and Benoit's pushes it literally solves all the problems that arose. Eddie gets a great Wrestlemania moment, Benoit finally beats Brock and finally beats Angle in a title match, Eddie melts down and the title can be hotshotted to several people who are instantly accepted and able to carry the ball, Benoit can have great matches until the time comes to drop the title to whoever. Benoit/JBL or Benoit/Taker in 2004 would've been fun, as well.

 

[Big Papa Paegan]

You aren't wrong on, like, any level. You can even do a take on the "HBK signs Benoit's contract" angle where Eddie steals HBK's contract, or something.

In hindsight, we get better matches at WM20, as well. Eddie/Angle was very good, but Benoit/Angle had already proven time and again for the last 4 years to be the best match the company could've put on. Without the 2007 tragedy, the Benoit/HHH/HBK match was already great, but I really think Eddie in it would have made it much more entertaining minute-by-minute, and it opens up a finish that could've easily built into the Backlash rematch that happened anyway: HBK knocks HHH with Sweet Chin Music but Eddie breaks the cover with a Frog Splash before getting the win, or HHH with a Pedigree into the Frog Splash spot.

 

[Cackling Co Pilot Kamala]

Eddie even does the obligatory, unnecessary Kane program better than Benoit.

I am smiling just imagining Eddie selling being terrified of Kane.

 

[Valeyard]

Eddie makes that threeway awesome. He has the style and charisma to make it work more than just being the formula (bonus points if HHH taps to the Lasso From El Paso). More than anything I think you can get a ton out of mileage out of Eddie and Shawn throughout the year because I can't see any scenario where they don't click and even if Eddie melts down, I can see him and Shawn being Bible Bros helping cushion him much better.

Benoit/Cena at Summerslam > Benoit/Orton at Summerslam.

 

[Cackling Co Pilot Kamala]

Since I am not going to start a TV PG era nostalgia thread…yet(ever hopefully).

Ykw match I just thought of that I am bummed we never got to see? Mark Henry Vs Brock Lesnar. Maybe it happened in a quickie TV match in ‘02/‘03 before Mark Henry. It seemed like Mark Henry’s push down the card into part timer-dom, started just as Brock Lesnar came back. 2011 Mark Henry is right behind pre ankle surgery Andre The Giant for dream Brock opponent in my mind.

 

[Valeyard]

Mark Henry got really good once he grew the dreads. Declined rapidly when he cut them. Just worth mentioning. I think he was on Raw during Brock's initial run.

Brock/Hansen, Brock/Kobashi, or Brock/Steamboat for me.

 

[Cackling Co Pilot Kamala]

Him and Brock were on Smackdown! when he was doing the World's Strongest Man ('00s version) gimmick for a few months. Mark Henry had long dreads in a pony tail and wasn't good yet.

And it does look like Brock squashed Mark Henry in the buildup to SummerSlam '02.

Should have had him squash all of the NoD members still on the roster. D Lo would've sold for Brock magnificently!

Edit- Checking on YouTube, there was an angle in late 2013-early 2014 where Brock Lesnar repeatedly beat the shit out of Mark Henry but it never led to a match cause WWE is going to WWE.

Mark Henry became really washed really quickly, which is a shame considering how long of a road he had to the top.

 

[Valeyard]

See I feel like once Henry turned heel and showed up on Raw trying to kill Goldberg, he was on the way up. That Smackdown run I remember most for him being in the best shape of his life and busting ass despite not having the chance to show off with anyone before he got hurt again.

 

[Cackling Co Pilot Kamala]

His '03-'04 RAW character was kind of the prototype for the Hall of Pain character.

He tore his quad in early '04 and was out all of the year and all of ‘05 (except a rehab stint in OVP) and that really eliminated whatever career momentum he had built up. If he was healthy, I have to imagine he would have been in the running for the JBL got. Mark Henry getting pushed to the stratosphere would've made way more sense tbh. Eddie Vs Mark Henry is another match I wish we would've gotten.

 

[Valeyard]

Batista/Henry is one of history's most cursed matches.

Henry ended up okay but not what he could've been. But, like, he was an injury prone monster that was ten years older than everyone.

 

[Cackling Co Pilot Kamala]

It is amazing that Mark Henry had the greatest run of his career after his forgettable stint as a Kool Aid Man, incompetent John Cena sidekick.

 

[Valeyard]

He's top of the list for guys who would've thrived in the NXT era. He could've been Keith Lee if the performance center existed in 1997.

 

[BruiserBrody]

He's top of the list for guys who would've thrived in the NXT era. He could've been Keith Lee if the performance center existed in 1997.

WWF wanted him to quit because they were mad at him for them signing him to a LONG and lucrative contract.

He was hurt early and often at first. The locker room who was just coming out of 1994-95 shit pay were pissed that a rookie got a fat contract and Henry was stiff kicked several times during an early tug of war angle.
Somebody shit in a sandwich Henry was going to eat.
WWF then sent him off to lose weight, and Henry dropped tonnage. Almost as soon as that happened, then they told him they wanted to double down on his strongman gimmick and told him to put the bulk back on - once again hoping he would quit.
Henry powered through for that $$$$

 

[Valeyard]

I'm talking about his willingness to improve and love of the business more than anything. Given the resources that exist now, he could've been a true great somewhere. He was done dirty so many times but I don't know why they didn't just push him forever to justify the contract.

 

[BruiserBrody]

I'm talking about his willingness to improve and love of the business more than anything. Given the resources that exist now, he could've been a true great somewhere. He was done dirty so many times but I don't know why they didn't just push him forever to justify the contract.

Because he got hurt and was over shadowed by a ton of guys for all of the boom period. They sure could have used him to break up the Taker/Austin/Kane/Manking doldrums after a while but.... was he really ready push or not? I guess I have to go see how his matches with Rock and Vader look from the era. It'd be hard to put him in that mix before Shamrock/Rock/HHH in 98. Then Angle/Eddy/Benoit in 2000.

Had we gotten Ron Simmons/Henry instead of 2 Cold/Simmons and the Acolytes.... maybe his star would shine quicker if they had been in the tag team mix. Or they'd be overshadowed by the NOA, Dudleys, etc

 

[Big Papa Paegan]

Do we need to add Mark Henry to "what if ECW" roster?

 

[Cackling Co Pilot Kamala]

He is one of the few WWE guys who thrived in WWECW so, yeah, you’d have to assume he would have done well in the real ECW.

 

[Hawk 34]

He would been in the Rhino role for sure so you can decide if we missed out on that.

 

[BruiserBrody]

Do we need to add Mark Henry to "what if ECW" roster?

A clean cut Olympian in a locker room full of druggies and a promoter who is asking you for loans instead of paying you 500K a year. I think he'd quit and join a speaker's circuit or something. Maybe become a Hoss Bodyguard for hire.