Cackling Co Pilot Kamala
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I mean he is the only completely likable creature in this scenario so I can see why.
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AEW in Fall 2022- Spreading lies and bullshit to the media.
- Thread starter Cackling Co Pilot Kamala
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Cackling Co Pilot Kamala
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First part sounds like a preview of TSMCon
HSJ
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How many tournaments have they had this year?
Tino Standard
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Meltzer made some comments that Punk was going around telling people to stop doing shit that got them over in the first place. I don’t know what specifically but he said that when someone wouldn’t do what Punk said, Punk would get extremely angry. Meltzer also said someone with that kind of attitude isn’t good for the company at all.
Cackling Co Pilot Kamala
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Playing devil's advocate here (RIP Sean O'Haire), as much as CM Punk talks about being an open book and available for advice, he's been a stand-offish and combative locker room presence his entire career.
I feel like we're going to see Eddie Kingston's promo on Punk on a loop for the next few months. And I think Punk's reaction is just as telling. He's just doing his sarcastic, condescending smirk the entire time while Eddie tells it like it is.
I love Punk as a performer and he'll go down as one of the greats of his generation but if I saw him at a coffee shop, I'm leaving him the heck alone.
I feel like we're going to see Eddie Kingston's promo on Punk on a loop for the next few months. And I think Punk's reaction is just as telling. He's just doing his sarcastic, condescending smirk the entire time while Eddie tells it like it is.
I love Punk as a performer and he'll go down as one of the greats of his generation but if I saw him at a coffee shop, I'm leaving him the heck alone.
RedJed
Rasslin' Rambler
Yeah, I just listened to that audio on the subject, I think that issue (Punk wanting to "teach" and not getting responded to well in some cases) is really what started all this. Punk in his program with Page likely was treating things in that way with him, and Page didn't respond well to that feedback or advice (which could easily be taken more as disrespect and less like anything else) and then pair it with the Page promo kind of dropping subtle hints that he didn't care for Punk's attitude in the back and shit started from there. That interview Page did a few weeks ago didn't help things at all really, it just brought back to the surface and revisited this issue.
To be fair, I wonder if Page was ever reprimanded for that stuff from earlier in the year where he cut that promo kinda dogging Punk out of the blue? He certainly should have been, but if he never was, no wonder this shit got so fucking out of control. That was the single point where Punk may have said fuck it about everything and everyone because Page went into business before he did.
Chances are Page isn't the only one who responded that way to Punk too if that was in fact the case that he was going around telling workers that stuff. I could see it coming off really heavy handed, almost like a micro managing of talent in a sense, depending on how it was worded and the approach taken by Punk.
So now given what went down on Dynamite, will Punk ever be back? I assume the Bucks, Omega, etc are probably suspended for maybe what, a month? With Punk he's out at least 6-8 months now, and I just wonder if he will really ever return to AEW. I still wonder about the ROH direction upon a return, but Punk might be too proud to take that demotion. I'd offer it to him without any change in contract structure, because he really COULD do that mentoring/advice to talent stuff endlessly if you had a roster of more up and coming talent that are looking to get over and get noticed, etc. And he really could be the guy to make that brand really over to the masses and the ability to do successfully financial tours with him on top a few weekends a month, etc.
I found it interesting that the top legal rep for AEW was WITH the Bucks, Omega, Daniels, etc as they walked into the room to talk to Punk. So I'd say so much for kicking down a door, that clearly did not happen if you had her with. I think this is probably why this situation is so serious in a way, because you had someone that pretty much can confirm independantly what happened and what didn't happen.
To be fair, I wonder if Page was ever reprimanded for that stuff from earlier in the year where he cut that promo kinda dogging Punk out of the blue? He certainly should have been, but if he never was, no wonder this shit got so fucking out of control. That was the single point where Punk may have said fuck it about everything and everyone because Page went into business before he did.
Chances are Page isn't the only one who responded that way to Punk too if that was in fact the case that he was going around telling workers that stuff. I could see it coming off really heavy handed, almost like a micro managing of talent in a sense, depending on how it was worded and the approach taken by Punk.
So now given what went down on Dynamite, will Punk ever be back? I assume the Bucks, Omega, etc are probably suspended for maybe what, a month? With Punk he's out at least 6-8 months now, and I just wonder if he will really ever return to AEW. I still wonder about the ROH direction upon a return, but Punk might be too proud to take that demotion. I'd offer it to him without any change in contract structure, because he really COULD do that mentoring/advice to talent stuff endlessly if you had a roster of more up and coming talent that are looking to get over and get noticed, etc. And he really could be the guy to make that brand really over to the masses and the ability to do successfully financial tours with him on top a few weekends a month, etc.
I found it interesting that the top legal rep for AEW was WITH the Bucks, Omega, Daniels, etc as they walked into the room to talk to Punk. So I'd say so much for kicking down a door, that clearly did not happen if you had her with. I think this is probably why this situation is so serious in a way, because you had someone that pretty much can confirm independantly what happened and what didn't happen.
geniusMoment
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It isn't just Punk though. A lot of those indy guys in AEW don't listen to anybody. Regal has talked about how he and Bryan run a clinic before the shows and no one shows up. Konnan confirmed that on his podcast. Punk obviously gets mad about it because he's kind of a dick (always has been). But, there is also a difference between what will get someone over on an indy scale, and what will translate into mainstream success. I have zero faith in Dave Meltzer's reporting when it comes to that type of stuff (especially when one side are his Elite friends).
It's pretty obvious where Dave's bias will be in this reporting and what side most of his sources will be on, so I can't take any of his reporting seriously. My guess is from here on out we are going to hear how horrible Punk was backstage to everyone, how he was out of touch, how these indy guys all got over on their own and how he was trying to change everything about them to the detriment of their success. Classic hit job.
It's pretty obvious where Dave's bias will be in this reporting and what side most of his sources will be on, so I can't take any of his reporting seriously. My guess is from here on out we are going to hear how horrible Punk was backstage to everyone, how he was out of touch, how these indy guys all got over on their own and how he was trying to change everything about them to the detriment of their success. Classic hit job.
Cackling Co Pilot Kamala
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Eddie Kingston has known Punk for 20 years though and is consistent about him being a miserable POS to work with.
No one who worked with Punk in WWE is rushing to defend him either. Maybe people just don't enjoy working with the guy?
No one who worked with Punk in WWE is rushing to defend him either. Maybe people just don't enjoy working with the guy?
Tino Standard
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Lost in the shuffle last night, are we finally done with trying to shoehorn JR into half of Dynamite?
geniusMoment
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You can not like someone, but Meltzer reporting that "having someone like that in your company is bad" in response to Punk is absurd. Before Punk went against The Elite Meltzer would've never reported that. And we know exactly where that information is coming from.
Cackling Co Pilot Kamala
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CM Punk is an indie cuck too though at heart. I think that's where the conflict lies. Two generations and mindsets of the same pack going head to head.
It sounds like he's being shuffled off to Rampage permanently.
Hasn't it been officially disproven that The Elite were Meltzer's source for the Colt Cabana dirt?
And most of the reporting ITT is from SRS. Is he cozying up to The Elite too?
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Fall of Epic
Epic Reine
Is there anybody in AEW that has gotten over with their indy-rrific gimmick outside of Orange Cassidy?
Cackling Co Pilot Kamala
Integral Poster
He doesn't have a gimmick but I'd argue Eddie Kingston is very indie (Indy is nickname for Indiana and its capital fyi) and hasn't changed his persona to make it more appealing for a national television audience.
Indie is to wrestling what alternative was to music in the '90s though. AJ Styles and Seth Rollins work a style that previous generations would say is very indie like but they're WWE stalwarts.
Indie is to wrestling what alternative was to music in the '90s though. AJ Styles and Seth Rollins work a style that previous generations would say is very indie like but they're WWE stalwarts.
geniusMoment
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Just listened to the audio. LOL And of course the Bill Watts comparison about not understanding the business now. Dave constantly says "what works, works" when it comes to people complaining about wrestling now. Well, if you look at the numbers, Punk was AEW's biggest draw, so by Dave's own definition that would make Punk not out of touch. He even outdrew Omega's return match after a 9 month layoff.
It doesn't mean you need to do everything he says. And it doesn't mean he isn't a dick. But, I can already tell how the reporting is going to all of a sudden paint him as history's greatest monster that you just can't have in your company no matter what.
Meanwhile, for the last year we didn't really hear anything about this. The second he went against The Elite we hear he's giving all these people this horrible advice, and doesn't understand the business now.
It doesn't mean you need to do everything he says. And it doesn't mean he isn't a dick. But, I can already tell how the reporting is going to all of a sudden paint him as history's greatest monster that you just can't have in your company no matter what.
Meanwhile, for the last year we didn't really hear anything about this. The second he went against The Elite we hear he's giving all these people this horrible advice, and doesn't understand the business now.
Big Beard Booty Daddy
Canadian Destroyer213
Someone coming back after 7 years away that fans have been clamoring for and heavily teased to the point that everyone knew he would be there, and someone coming back from injury, who they stupidly didn't promote isn't the greatest comparison. The ratings for the following episodes since he he came back did go up, but there were also other things going on for those episodes, so I'm not saying he was the only thing to draw the numbers, but they did go up when fans realized he was back.
Cackling Co Pilot Kamala
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Also I don't think it's emphasized enough that friggin COLT CABANA is the fact that launched a thousand ships IRT to this kerfuffle.
And I don't even think Colt Cabana was that mistreated in this ordeal. Afaik, wasn't he paid this entire time? And it's not exactly he was getting a hot push before CM Punk came in!
And I don't even think Colt Cabana was that mistreated in this ordeal. Afaik, wasn't he paid this entire time? And it's not exactly he was getting a hot push before CM Punk came in!
geniusMoment
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I'm talking about on the same show. The show where Omega returned the Punk segment on that show outdrew it. And we're a year out from his return, so it isn't just "he's getting numbers because he was away for so long at this point".
geniusMoment
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And I'm not saying Punk is innocent in all this. What I'm saying is the last day or so it feels like the wagons are being circled around him by the usual crew whenever certain people are criticized.
I absolutely think Punk is a dick. Shouldn't have punched anyone. Should be disclipined.
I absolutely think Punk is a dick. Shouldn't have punched anyone. Should be disclipined.
Cackling Co Pilot Kamala
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Back to in the ring stuff for a moment, who do you think wins the World Title Tournament?
IMO, as unexciting and predictable as it is, you kind of have to go back to Moxley and build to him Vs MJF at Full Gear, right?
Danielson's got the mainstream recognition but he's got the same durability issues as Punk. Can you rely on him being healthy for a sustained period of time? Jericho and Sammy Guevara absolutely not. Darby for a variety of reasons is someone I'm really unsure of building a company around.
IMO, as unexciting and predictable as it is, you kind of have to go back to Moxley and build to him Vs MJF at Full Gear, right?
Danielson's got the mainstream recognition but he's got the same durability issues as Punk. Can you rely on him being healthy for a sustained period of time? Jericho and Sammy Guevara absolutely not. Darby for a variety of reasons is someone I'm really unsure of building a company around.
and it looks like Sammy Guevara does go over Darby on Friday so obviously Coach Tony K agrees with me on that front.
geniusMoment
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I would have Danielson win it. It's too soon for Mox again, especially since MJF should win the title at the next PPV. Danielson just replaces Punk.
I think Danielson (even more than Mox) could give MJF an all time classic PPV match.
But, based off last night, my guess is Mox again.
I think Danielson (even more than Mox) could give MJF an all time classic PPV match.
But, based off last night, my guess is Mox again.
geniusMoment
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FYI...Some people are still happy in AEW:
geniusMoment
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Some people are not:
My theory is Danielson wins over Mox, Mox has some out he can hang his hat on.
He gets the vacation he was supposed to be on and as a thank you from Tony since Tony is big on that, Mox returns for the title rematch at the Tuesday Night Dynamite in Cincy, putting the belt back on Mox can be a TK decision he can make but either way the winner of that gets MJF at the PPV.
He gets the vacation he was supposed to be on and as a thank you from Tony since Tony is big on that, Mox returns for the title rematch at the Tuesday Night Dynamite in Cincy, putting the belt back on Mox can be a TK decision he can make but either way the winner of that gets MJF at the PPV.
Cackling Co Pilot Kamala
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I know everyone hates multi-man matches almost as much as tournaments but maybe even MJF-Mox-Danielson triple threat at Full Gear is an option?
Cackling Co Pilot Kamala
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This editorial is p. close to my thoughts.
Big Beard Booty Daddy
Canadian Destroyer213
I think this is pretty good. I've never been a fan of Jake, never cared about him, but he's been used perfectly in AEW. He's Jericho's heavy, has a match every now and then, but when he does have a match comes off as a threat, even if we know he won't win. He doesn't cut promos a lot, and when he does they're usually small.
Valeyard
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This is flawed btw
On the subject of Punk giving advice I would say it depends who he gave advice to. You really don't need to be giving unsolicited critical advice to Hangman Page or tell Hangman that he doesn't know what he's doing in the ring. The guy worked a flawless 90 minutes with Bryan Danielson, I think he knows what he's doing. This is one situation where I side against Punk because I'm one of those kinds of people who fucking hates being told how to do something that the person should know I know how to do.
We also know that Punk is an abrasive type so the idea that he's giving out advice nicely all the time or some shit, that part is hard for me to believe. I don't know if anyone remembers the story about when he was in WWE and tried to make young guys clean up his and everyone else's trash and it didn't go over well.
We also know that Punk is an abrasive type so the idea that he's giving out advice nicely all the time or some shit, that part is hard for me to believe. I don't know if anyone remembers the story about when he was in WWE and tried to make young guys clean up his and everyone else's trash and it didn't go over well.